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+--- Thread: traction tire for steam loco? (/showthread.php?tid=4687)
traction tire for steam loco? - leon - 12-29-2011
Years ago I bought a Spectrum train set featuring a Pennsy K4 with three passenger cars. This Chriatmas I decided to run some HO trains instead of my N scale. To my dissapointment this K4 doesnt seem to have the pull I had expected. I live in a older house which has settled which in turn gives a natural grade to my track. If I have the three cars behind the Loco--it will not pull them up this small grade. My question is: Can I find a driver set with traction tires for this Locomotive? If so, where can I purchase them? I also have a small 0-4-0T that does the job just fine! :?
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - Puddlejumper - 12-29-2011
I don't know if there are drivers with traction tires that will fit that loco or not. You may want to try bullfrog snot. I think that is what it is called. You apply it with a brush, after it drys it acts like a traction tire.
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - nachoman - 12-29-2011
Have you tried contacting bachmann? If you search for "traction tire" on the walthers website, you get 7 pages of results! Perhaps one of them will work?
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - Charlie B - 12-29-2011
Several years ago I bought the complete Burlington Zephyr set in HO from BLI. Just for the heck of it I coupled my PRR T-1 to the cars (12 total). It wouldn't pull them on level track. (It would pull 15 other coaches and 5 head end cars with ease.) I took every car axle from the trucks and filed the ends of the axles because there were tiny barbs on many of them. After that It will pull the train up a 30 foot 2 percent grade so I reccomend checking the wneels for gauge and the axles and journals for flash.
Charlie
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - Bob C - 12-29-2011
The voice of experience from Charlie ! ...and I'll toss in my $.02...if the loco hasn't been run in quite a while - or never - a good clean and lube for the drive and wheels might be in order, too. Treat it like a "new" loco...clean, check gauge, run it by itself...slowly, looking for hang-ups/glitches in the rods, gears, etc. Likely the loco will loosen up and work fine or you'll find some easily corrected glitch - there or on the cars. I know, when I sit too long, I don't move like I should, either. Charlie, on the other hand, never slows down ! Bob C.
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - Green_Elite_Cab - 12-29-2011
leon Wrote:Years ago I bought a Spectrum train set featuring a Pennsy K4 with three passenger cars. This Chriatmas I decided to run some HO trains instead of my N scale. To my dissapointment this K4 doesnt seem to have the pull I had expected. I live in a older house which has settled which in turn gives a natural grade to my track. If I have the three cars behind the Loco--it will not pull them up this small grade. My question is: Can I find a driver set with traction tires for this Locomotive? If so, where can I purchase them? I also have a small 0-4-0T that does the job just fine! :?
I definitely would check to make sure those passenger cars roll REALLY easy (as in roll down a slight hill with no nudges, or anything, just simply releasing the cars). If the coaches don't roll free, then they are probably holding your K4 up.
Weight and its distribution are also important. It may sound counter intuitive, but the "larger" steam locomotive will probably have less pull than one with a "lesser" wheel configuration. In the case of your K4, you have 6 drivers all distributing weight, and 4 pilots/ 2 trailing wheels that may also be "taking the weight off". Your 0-4-0 on the other hand has all of its weight on relatively few drivers. It automatically is going to be able to hold onto the rails better than your K4, despite its small size. If you can get more weight right above the drivers in the boiler somewhere, this would be the most Ideal solution.
Puddlejumper Wrote:I don't know if there are drivers with traction tires that will fit that loco or not. You may want to try bullfrog snot. I think that is what it is called. You apply it with a brush, after it drys it acts like a traction tire.
I love Bullfrog Snot, and I use it on many of my diesels and Electrics. That said, be VERY careful when using it with a steam locomotive. If any of the snot gets flung into the side rods and other gear, its a PAIN to clean and can cause the model to jam. Just gotta be careful with it.
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - Russ Bellinis - 12-30-2011
I don't know how Bachmann did the suspension for the lead and trailing trucks on the K-4, but on an early Bachmann + 4-8-4 they had such strong springs pushing down the lead and trailing trucks that those springs were actually lifting the drivers off of the rails! It was so bad that the locomotive would not pull itself and tender around on a straight and level track!
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - leon - 12-31-2011
I never heard of Bulldog Snot. Is it easy to obtain and what is the aproximate price?
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - BR60103 - 12-31-2011
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://bullfrogsnot.com/">http://bullfrogsnot.com/</a><!-- m -->
price about $25 for a small jar. But you shouldn't need much unless you're redoing a club layout.
I don't know if you need a groove in the wheel or can just put it on the tire.
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - leon - 01-01-2012
Bulfrog Snot---$25 for a small jar? Quite expensive considering my small layout having trouble with one or possibly as hi as three locos. (I have around 10 or twelve locos of various types) Has anyone experimented with a different product? This is the first time I heard of BFS and I am not realy familiar with the product. Also-can one purchase smaller amounts?
Leon
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - Sumpter250 - 01-01-2012
There is the possibility, that your local hobby shop might have an open container of BFS,and that they might be willing to "treat" a set of your drivers, with a first coat. It doesn't hurt to ask.....
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - Green_Elite_Cab - 01-01-2012
BR60103 Wrote:http://bullfrogsnot.com/
price about $25 for a small jar. But you shouldn't need much unless you're redoing a club layout.
I don't know if you need a groove in the wheel or can just put it on the tire.
It creates a thin film on regular wheels if applied correctly. Essentially, I use a small flat screw driver with a small blob on the end, and run the locomotive upside down. I then spread the bullfrog snot on the wheel until it is consistently covering the wheel surface. You are then supposed to allow the wheel to spin for approximately 15 minutes, which smooths out the bull frog snot as it hardens. You loose some electrical contact on that wheel, but its never been a problem for me.
In particular, I use the bullfrog snot on my small AEM7 electrics. The prototype can haul 9 car trains solo, but the model was only able to approach about 5 or 6 passenger cars on straight, level track. unmodified. The bullfrog snot and some additional weight allowed me to pull prototype length trains up a 4% grade on our club. Bullfrog snot will definitely eliminate wheel slip. its easy to remove if you don't like it.
You'll never run out of your jar, and for as long as I've had my jar of it, it hasn't gotten hard or weird in the jar, so it doesn't seem like it will go bad either.
I say find a friend who has some or bite the bullet and pick it up. Its the only useful product of its type, so you're kind of stuck with it.
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - Bob C - 01-02-2012
Maybe I missed or misinterpreted something but didn't see it mentioned anywhere that the reason the K4 won't pull - is wheel slip ? If the wheels aren't spinning, a traction increase (BFS or otherwise) won't help the problem. Are the drivers spinning/slipping, Leon ? :? Bob C.
Re: traction tire for steam loco? - leon - 01-02-2012
To all concerned: I have found the culprit! One of the passenger cars is the problem! I checked the trucks and found that the wheels darn near dissapear into the side frames causing all kinds friction drag!! This the cause of the difficulty on the up grade---on the level it appears to work fine. I guess I will have to send the car back to Bachmann for repair since it is a Spectrum train set.
Thanks to all; Leon
