California Northern layout in HO
#31
Glad it is of use to you Jonte.

Obviously operations, whatever you model, can enhance any model railroad. Whether it is Japanese railways, Dutch, English or North American, trains serve a purpose. It is to transport various commodities and/or people from A to B etc. I find it adds to my enjoyment of 'playing with trains'. Of course, like most, I can enjoy a train 'just running by' through nicely executed scenery, and I have been 'guilty' of that, but after a while you probably want more. Operations is one aspect that could be that.

One thing stands out though, never over complicate things. Don't bite of more than you can chew, basically. So don't build a basement empire with loads of industries and yards, if you can't reasonably see it finished, and if you're going to be the only one operating it, you'll drown. if you have help, or can have additional people help in operating, and share the hobby in such a way, then that's great.

For the majority of us, a small layout will probably be most rewarding, whether it's a shelf layout depicting a small industrial area and switching cars, or a passenger station, or even a 4x8 run around type affair, it depends on the individual wants and needs, but it's got to be of a manageable size so you can see it to completion within a reasonable time, otherwise boredom and frustration might come into play.

Personally I do like the social aspect, hence I like the modular layout concept. It enables me to meet like minded people, share the hobby, and run trains , operate them as the prototype would (or at least attempt it) on a much larger and more complex scale than I could ever achieve at home.

Koos
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#32
I too, think the modular approach is catching on over here in England, more people talk about it on forums. I would like to, perhaps, make a module that could be attched to a fiddle yard board for use at home, unlikely to ever be hooked up to other peoples, but it would allow me the re use of said fiddle yard board with another module. Space is in very short supply these days, & small layouts are the rule for most modellers. Operations is a big part of layouts built for home use, whereas show layouts are built to entertain the paying public (in the main).
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#33
hi Keith,

thanks for dropping in and share your view. I wouldn't be too worried about ever being able to share your module.
While I do not know your personal circumstances, I am aware you live away from some of the other people that might be module owners. However where's a will there's usually a way. Even if you manage to join your module once per year and you make it a 'weekend outing' , then all good. :-)
Similarly you could travel and instead of bringing a module, you can join as just an operator. My personal circumstances is that I make it to a meeting about 4 to 6 times each year, never every month like some of our group can do. I have a traveling job which means that weekends at home are precious and my family takes up my time.

Your layout plans/project sound like what many people with limited space would do, and it typical for many UK based model railroaders.

Koos
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#34
But to get back to the question I was raising about the photos: it seems to me that a study of Kamerad47 and bdw9535's photos here would be very helpful. Both of them appear to be inspired by the real world that they see around them. Kamerad47's work is especially remarkable, because he's doing it on a suspended 4 x 8 in a garage (a typical small size in the US), but the sense of real-world purpose in every scene means you don't focus on the household materials on the shelves in the background! This is what's lacking from almost every UK layout I see, no matter how small or big, and no matter how well the scenery is done. Same with Bruce/bdw9535, he is using logical equipment and portraying it doing logical things. The trains have symbols or job numbers, which make the photos easier to relate to and to understand what's happening.

in contrast, you have a new-looking UP 8-40CW on the junkyard siding in a couple of photos. Why is it there? Is it being scrapped? Why are the squeaky-clean SP units on the CFNR, when they should be much dirtier if they're there at all? What are any of these locos actually doing? Where is a train, and what is it doing? For instance, the current traffic through Napa Jct, which one of your stations is named for, is primarily traffic for the Northwestern Pacific, and that is mainly poultry feed in covered hoppers, with a little lumber in centerbeams. I think a knowledgeable reader would find it reassuring to see that sort of traffic represented at Napa Jct. If you don't want to go that far, name the station something fictitious and explain you aren't really modeling CFNR very seriously, but of course that takes us back to many other UK layouts, it's New England or Florida, but not so much except the trees (and you swap those out before the next show). Or do a google search for youtube videos of CFNR in Woodland, also named on your layout, and look at the traffic and the equipment. Otherwise, just say it's the California Pacific and it's sorta-kinda, so you won't raise unreasonable expectations!

On the other hand, if you wanted to be flexible as to era, traffic through Napa Jct during the SP era would also be from the NWP, but it would be 100-car trains of lumber headed by 6 SD9s. Again, not what you're doing and not recognizable by knowledgeable people.

Again, I'm saying this only because you've invited less then enthusiastic comments and would not say this unless asked.
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#35
No offense taken JWB :-)

Many have a lot of rational explanations:
First off : Most pictures were not taken during operating sessions, I just lined up some trains to grace the shots here and there.

I am well behind in getting my SP fleet dirtied up, (similar for most rolling stock), and that UP unit just happen to be there because I wanted to test it. It normally doesn't operate on the layout. I'm very much keen on getting the operations, the type of traffic, locomotives , cars etc included fit for the era I model. A little modelers licence will be sprinkled on I have to admit. I am not intending to make this a 100% accurate depiction , I've mixed in a few things of something I like.

Things in that regard are moving (VERY) slowly, but I will get there. Centrebeam cars etc are definitely on the cards for the future, I just haven't found any good models yet. I have started this project only a few years ago, and all my rolling stock and locomotives have been purchased in the same period. So it really is very early stages.

I have started weathering some freight cars in the meantime. All and all, this is very much a work in progress, hence I post here, and take on board all praise and criticisms that come along in order to learn from them.

Of course, I'll have another look at the people layouts you have mentioned in your post, to fully understand where your question comes from.

Again thanks for your comments. I appreciate you take the time to do so .

Koos

PS: As a quick edit after I posted this original: I'll try and take some more pictures in the future, with a more fitting caption and 'scene' , more in line with the title of this thread, to show the link between the layout and the real world (or at least how it was at one point in the early 90's).
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#36
When you get the March MR, it's worth reading Besougloff's editorial on photos. A photo should have a clear purpose, it seems to me. If you want to show off a new loco, focus in on it and avoid distractions (like the fact that it's in a junk yard). If you want to show scenery, show scenery. I'd be especially interested at this point in whether you're focusing your layout and showing how your depiction of the rail scene is evolving. How about showing a train with appropriate locos and traffic, not to mention weathering? It sounds like this is the direction you want to go in.
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#37
A youtube of power and traffic at the end of SP <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://nwprr.net/video/day-on-the-northwestern-pacific-1993">http://nwprr.net/video/day-on-the-north ... cific-1993</a><!-- m --> -- by 1993, traffic was way down. Five or ten years earlier, there would have been 6 SD9s, not 3.

A youtube of the area now: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://nwprr.net/video/union-pacific-rr-in-american-canyon">http://nwprr.net/video/union-pacific-rr ... can-canyon</a><!-- m -->
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#38
Thanks for the links JWB, I've enjoyed watching those.

I will look out for March MR.

Koos
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#39
Looking back at your plan and the background description, a couple of things occur to me. The part you call a "classification yard" in the lower left actually corresponds to the interchange yard now at American Canyon, earlier at Schellville. Schellville was the traditional place where the SP stopped and the Northwestern Pacific began, although after about 1960, trains just ran through there and had a final destination of Roseville. My thinking would be to conflate the yards at American Canyon and Schellville and call the yard Schellville, which even now is a more interesting place, with a station and lots of eucalyptus trees. I would treat the classification tracks as visible staging. The revived NWP keeps its locos there, but that is recent and was not done by the SP/NWP.

At minimum, it's good to give everything a name. So call the classification/staging "Schellville". Actually, lots of tracks have names on the prototype, too, or at least numbers. Here are a couple photos of Schellville:

   

   
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#40
Thanks very much JWB, those are great pictures!
It also gives me another good indication of the colour of the soil in the area. The various 'BING' and 'GOOGLE EARTH' shots I have all vary due to the weather and sunlight conditions at the time. I am not happy yet with the depot area soil colour, too sandy I believe on my layout, I need to tone it down a little.

Yes indeed, what I called classification yard, is indeed a little further south on the line towards American Canyon, thanks for letting me know it wasn't a classification yard, but an interchange. I Also like your suggestion to call it Schellville, eventhough on the layout the two are so much closer to eachother, but it helps during an operating session in the future to indeed give it a name.

Just curious, do you live in the area, considering you having these pictures, or did you pick those up on a rail fanning trip?

Thanks again, Koos
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#41
My wife and I go to Napa pretty frequently for the food and wine, and sometimes she tolerates railfan side-trips. I did railfan the NWP several times in the 1980s as well.
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#42
Gleaned from here (What makes a model railroad great?) <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/16865">http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/16865</a><!-- m --> which appeared only recently in Mr. Fugate's excellent 'Model Rail Road Hobbyist' magazine, the Blogger ventured the following:

" Purpose.... Give your railroad one!! I think a 6 foot shelf layout with staging on both ends is more prototypical and could have more operating potential than 50 % of published layout plans out there."

I sincerely hope you don't mind me posting this on your thread, Koos, only I thought it might prove of interest in light of recent discussions here on this very topic.

Regards,

Jonte
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#43
No problem Jonte,

If this thread starts to get too side tracked, I will open a new topic and move the posts to there as not too distract too much from the topic of this one :-)


Thanks JWB, I understand. I hope to visit the area in the future, I love a glass of wine myself. When the kids grow up I like to travel there with my wife.

Koos
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#44
A couple of update pictures of my layout:

CFNR power at Napa Jct maintenance facilities:

[Image: 20785862154_f630814fb8_c.jpg]Layout updates. by Koos, on Flickr

SD40-T2 8304 leads a freight through Mendo, while a pair of SW1500's switch an industry lead.

[Image: 21221658119_34c066da83_c.jpg]Layout updates. by Koos, on Flickr

And another view of the area, I recently started to add vegetation to this section and still have a lot to do:

[Image: 21397658602_c7e9d36c14_c.jpg]Layout updates. by Koos, on Flickr

Koos
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