California Northern layout in HO

[sailormatlac]

Looks good to me!! I like the simple but effective track plan!

Matt

[jonte]

Many thanks, Koos, for a most interesting and comprehensive response(s) to my queries.

You've included additional information in your posts that hadn't even occurred to me - never having got that far before!!- so many thanks and thank you also for providing the useful links. I think I'm right in saying that Mr. Fulgate is the editor of the online magazine Model Railroad Hobbyist which I enjoy reading immensely.

Before I go, I must commend you on the standard of weathering applied to the track of your latest venture 'Treepoint'. I think I'm correct in saying you used washes of artists oils of varying colours to achieve the effect; wonderful! And, the removal of the plastic webbing and random spacing of the ties just seals the deal for me. I shall indeed enjoy watching all your ventures as they develop.

Best wishes,

Jonte

[torikoos]

Hi Jonte,

You are correct, Joe Fugate is the owner/editor of that magazine. I do like it myself , I have to say that the advertising gets a little in the way sometimes but it's free :-)

Treepoint is indeed another project I'm working on. A mix of thinned artist paints (acrylic) is indeed what I used there, applied randomly, and I let them blend and mix both on the pallet and on the ties so that I get an even larger colour range.
Cutting away the webbing does make a big difference in appearance, and is something that is 'doable' for a small project as that, where I didn't use more than 5 lengths of flex track. I did not remove the webbing from the turnouts to give them the extra strength.

I don't do this on my home layout as it would take up too much time, perhaps on a beaten old spur or siding in the future.

Glad to be of help.

Koos

PS: Where did you read about Treepoint? Was that on RMWeb, or on my blog? Just curious, as I haven't posted on here about it I believe. I think this has been the first reference :-)

[jonte]

Hi again, Koos.

First of all, please accept my humblest apologies for erroneously referring to 'Tree Point' as 'Treepoint', and thank you for politely not correcting me

I chanced upont it on RMWeb but studied the images on your Flickr account attached. Perhaps you should consider posting them here for the benefit of our fellow Gaugers?

Thank you also for pointing out that the type of paint used was acrylic and not oils as I'd incorrectly assumed.

I'd dearly like to give this method a go, although there will be very few ties on this project as per the prototype which were mostly buried under the ash type ballast, and those few I've planned will be made either from balsa which I have to hand, or a suitably grained modelling type wood which I'll purchase from my local modelling shop. Still, I'll have a bash as it should work as well on the wood as it did on the plastic. Incidentally, this is what I have in mind: Following a token distressing with a suitable instrument (I'll have to work that one out via trial or error) I plan to undercoat them with auto-primer (grey) that's lying on a shelf in my garage, before adding dirty washes of highly thinned Humbrol enamels - shades determined by whatever I find on my desk! - finished off with some of those cheapo powders I used on the cardboard kit bashes I did last year. I shall, however, bear in mind the shades of colour used by your good self and use them as a guide. Watch this space!

Best wishes,

Jonte

[torikoos]

Not to worry Jonte,

it is TREE POINT, but I have made the same mistake myself :-) As for distressing wood, I read somewhere on the web (the source escapes me for a moment) that it can be done using a small stiff copper brush (the size of a tooth brush) normally used to clean up solder joints etc, and a dental toothpick for some deeper gauges.

As for Tree Point, I will start a thread on it here too as you suggested. Your mention made me realise I forgot all about it.... (hangs head in shame...) :oops:

Koos

[faraway]

That looks very good. Especially the erosion of the ground left to the culvert without vegetation. The omitted vegetation emphasizes the other vegetation.

[Tyson Rayles]

Looks nice.

[torikoos]

Thanks for the comments all. I appreciate it.


In general, and one of the main reasons I post things on Big Blue is to share, and to hear others opinions.
It's good to know things look good in the eye of another person, which confirms I'm on the right track, but if you spot something 'wrong', I'd also like to know, as long as you tell me what you think is wrong , and how I could improve it. :-)

Koos

[jwb]

One question I have, in that case, is how this layout potentially differs from a diorama or a photo posing board. Is it set up to operate or otherwise behave like a railroad? One thing I see in UK style US prototype layouts is that they only come out at exhibitions, where the owners and operators are, by their own account, distracted by questions and other interaction with the visitors -- and in fact might be perceived as unsociable if they just concentrate on operation, since the assumption is that the visitors, or "punters" in UK parlance, are normally not well informed about the hobby and would rather ask basic questions or chat than watch. So the layouts are normally vertical in a closet, but when they come out, they can do little more than run back and forth at random to entertain the public. So in my view, many UK layouts are dioramas or conversation pieces rather than model railroads in the sense that many US modelers see the hobby.

A diorama is fine, but it isn't necessarily the same hobby. Do you do anything to operate this layout in a prototypical way?

[torikoos]

Hi jwb,

Interesting topic.
Let me answer that two fold, first about this layout:
It is located in my loft (attic), and it is , compared what you see in the US hobby press etc, rather small. UK houses are generally smaller than many in the US, which is another reason why people perhaps build dioramas btw.
Anyway, this layout (once progressed far enough), is meant to be operated by myself, and perhaps one other person. However I do like scenery and therefore I haven't crammed it full of track. I try to follow a prototype a little, but not 100%, space is the main culprit there again.. I haven't reached the stage that I can operate it much, a bit of switching I can do, but the trains don't as yet have another 'destination' to go and come from, there will be in the future though. Building this layout is happening in stages, and I try and add at least some basic scenery, before I move to the next section.

Second, your perception of the UK model railroad 'exhibitions' and modelers: While there is certainly some truth in what you write, particularly on the average show, operations is becoming more and more something people are interested in. This then usually is done with a modular layout. Again, people might have limited space, but can build a module. Joining these up forming a bigger layout in a sports hall or elsewhere, and set up operations.
I personally belong to a local railway modeling group (a division of the NMRA British Region), that does just that. Montly operating sessions, and within the NMRA - BR there are several others doing the same. These are members only gatherings with no members of the public.
A link of one such meet is here: <!-- l --><a class="postlink-local" href="http://bigbluetrains.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7203&hilit=Western+Union">viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7203&hilit=Western+Union</a><!-- l -->

Sometimes we join up with members of other groups, like here: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAhg4S63658">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAhg4S63658</a><!-- m -->

We've also demonstrated it at UK railway exhibitions, one of which had us operating a modular layout over 180 feet in length (150 of it on a modular branch) , it caught the eyes of people for a couple of reasons: It was the biggest layout there, we ran AMERICAN trains (at prototypical speeds and with sound, smoothly!), we showed that trains had a purpose and they 'operated' , not just rain back and forth or aimless rounds. We had a big enough crew that some of us concentrated on 'operations', while others were at hand to chat to the public. It was all well received.
Here's some footage of it: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OW_HfcsbjVE">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OW_HfcsbjVE</a><!-- m -->

Modular railroading , including operations certainly is gaining popularity here.

There is a large group of modelers that make a diorama, and just enjoy the building of it, and then show that off at shows, not sure if they do any other modeling at home, but it surely is the perception that they create and you seem to have noticed.

I must admit at this stage that I am very poorly informed about the general UK railway modeling scene, I've never interested myself in UK railways , I've always modelled US model railroads (since I was 20 ish), and before that I modeled german railways on a home layout.

Hope that answers your question a bit?

Koos

[jwb]

Do you do anything to move cars, locos, and/or trains in a logical way? In other words, from what I see on sites like rmweb, the tendency is to say OK, this is New England, Florida, whatever, I'm good, now I'm going to run my locos back and forth and that's it (this layout is now for sale). Do you do anything to get away from that?

[jonte]

I'm beginning to suspect, jwb, that your questions are rhetorical.

Jonte.

[jwb]

Only in part -- torikoos is asking what someone might point out as potentially being done otherwise than what one sees. I'm seeing some very good scenery work, but so far, I'm getting an idea from the photos that locos just run back and forth with no real purpose. I wouldn't raise this if we hadn't been invited to make that sort of comment.

[torikoos]

Hi jwb,

I'm not sure if you asking this as a general question, or to me. For myself the answer is , yes I (plan to) do something with the cars. They get destinations and get transported with 'purpose'. At the club we use JRMI to sort out the cars and their destinations. We don't just haul a hopper from A to B for the sake of it. It would go to / come from a grain loading facility for example , to be handled then sorted, and eventually leave from their for it's next assignment or destination. We're still learning about operations so I am sure we make mistakes, but the purpose is to have fun, and learn about real railroad operations in the process.
On my own layout I plan to do similar things, once it is completed sufficiently to actually do so.

So if your observation from the pictures is that there appears to be little in the way of operations, that is partly true because the layout hasn't been completed enough to get to point B, only point A exists, and is 80% ready track wise (some work remains on the controls of turnouts), but once done I can operate that as a switching layout with the trains arriving from 'rest of world', and using a switcher like the SW1500 in the pictures, to take cars from the arrival spur to the yard, sort the cars (or spot them at an industry, such as the scrap yard you've seen parts of) , and assemble a new train to be taken back to 'rest of world'.

What you see on RM (and elsewhere) is that people have build a small layout and switch on that. Some operate it as a switching puzzle (and often the trackplan reflects that), some attach staging or a traverser and try to run limited operations where the destinations are on the layout, and origins are in 'the rest of the world' , or vice versa. There's only so much you can do on a small layout like that. Others as you've observed, solely build it as an exhibition piece , a little island on it's own. Nothing wrong with that perse but it lacks the operations side of things.
In any of these cases however, it's largely because one has limited space and can't build much bigger, and what they like (or have been accustomed too).
If they enjoy it, then great. In our case with modular layouts, we're trying to show that there's more to model railroading than just inglenooks and switching puzzles etc, and certainly among the 'north american scene' this is catching on.

My new project Tree Point, will be operated like that as a stand alone, but when taken to the club, it will become part of a larger modular set up, and then the story gets more interesting.

Koos

[jonte]

A most reasoned and (for a newbie to the 'Dark Side' like me) enlightening response, Koos.

That's interesting to read.

Jonte