Freight Shed

[sailormatlac]

When checking old pictures and maps, I often see old freight sheds (most seems to date back to the late 1800s) located on the main line near the passenger station. It seems to be a classic location.

My question is, how were they served without fouling the main line. Honestly, I'm puzzled, except if it was for small goods that could be carried in combine and such cars with the regular passenger train.

Thank you!

Matt

[Brakie]

Matt,Unlike a freight hose these freight sheds was for freight express shipments carried in baggage cars or combine.
As a example-a person orders a Warm Morning stove from Sears..It will arrive on a passenger local or mixed train and will be unloaded at the shed..
Now it may take several minutes to unload the express freight shipments for a certain shed and that of course ties up the main but,its all part of day to day railroading.

[MountainMan]

Train schedules allowed for unloading times along the right of way.

[sailormatlac]

Thanks guys! It's what I thought. An interesting operation feature for a pre-modern layout.

I'll continue to dig this.

Matt

[Brakie]

Train schedules allowed for unloading times along the right of way.

In a perfect world yes but,not in real railroading since several factors could come into play such as extra express shipments can delay the unloading time not to mention the amount of work involved unloading and loading and never forget Mr.Murphy and his law..Of course unloading and loading must be done in a safe and orderly manner.

[BR60103]

From the two stations that I'm most familiar with (Perth and Brampton) the "freight house" near the station -- usually part of it or sharing a roof -- was for express shipments from passenger trains. Goods would be unloaded from baggage cars onto express carts (set so that when on the platform their floors matched the baggage cars) and then stored in the express rooms or loaded into trucks to go on.
I don't remember anything being unloaded from freight trains at the station. Perth had a reasonably sized freight yard with more buildings and various ramps and team tracks and tracks into a couple of the town's larger factories. The yard came off a passing siding that started beyond the passenger platform.
There was also a track that looped off and ran on the other side of the station than the main line -- actually beyond the parking lot. I never saw it used.

[sailormatlac]

From the two stations that I'm most familiar with (Perth and Brampton) the "freight house" near the station -- usually part of it or sharing a roof -- was for express shipments from passenger trains. Goods would be unloaded from baggage cars onto express carts (set so that when on the platform their floors matched the baggage cars) and then stored in the express rooms or loaded into trucks to go on.
I don't remember anything being unloaded from freight trains at the station. Perth had a reasonably sized freight yard with more buildings and various ramps and team tracks and tracks into a couple of the town's larger factories. The yard came off a passing siding that started beyond the passenger platform.
There was also a track that looped off and ran on the other side of the station than the main line -- actually beyond the parking lot. I never saw it used.

I'm so dumb, I forgot about the baggage cart to explain why these shed don't have a platform near the track...

I've often seen this looping track arrangement on many maps. I've got picture of one at Ste. Anne which is used as a team track with a rear platform behind the station with a cart loaded by an horse.

Thanks again!

Matt

[Brakie]

Matt,Unloading large express shipments(examples would be a stove or a Sears refrigerator) onto a baggage cart took time and was a tad dangerous so,instead of unloading these on to carts they would simply side them off the baggage car or combine onto the platform where they could easily move it with a regular 2 wheel freight dolly.The train crew would usually help the express agent(glorified baggage handler) unload the heavier shipments.

[jwb]

There's another complication, and that's that express and LCL were two different things. Express went in baggage or box-express cars in passenger trains. The Railway Express Agency was something like modern UPS, although you could ship larger things via REA than you can UPS. I've read that families that spent seasons in Maine or Florida would ship their household effects to their summer or winter homes via REA. LCL was different -- that could be the stove or refrigerator, or a crated bicycle, or whatever. Those went in a dedicated boxcar on a local freight. I'm pretty sure that REA express items -- trunks, parcels, etc -- would go from the baggage car to the express room at the depot, which was not the same as the freight house. LCL would probably be unloaded at the trackside freight shed, although this would be at a smaller station. I think at a station with a dedicated freight house, the LCL would go into the freight house from the dedicated LCL box car.

For that matter, LCL ran in its own national network via the individual railroads. It was sorted and reloaded at large freight houses in the cities. Some railroads had box cars specially dedicated and painted for LCL service.

[MountainMan]

Train schedules allowed for unloading times along the right of way.

In a perfect world yes but,not in real railroading since several factors could come into play such as extra express shipments can delay the unloading time not to mention the amount of work involved unloading and loading and never forget Mr.Murphy and his law..Of course unloading and loading must be done in a safe and orderly manner.

Out here in the Rocky Mountains, trains often stopped on the mainline to allow passengers to admire the scenery. Time was allowed in the schedules for such mundane and necessary tasks as coaling, watering, gawking at the sights and unloading goods.

Note an entire trainload of gawkers on the Palisades with time for a posed photograph, on the only single line trackage through the Continental Divide at the time. I would guess a good twenty minutes or more on this stop, during a "scheduled" run.

[Brakie]

There's another complication, and that's that express and LCL were two different things. Express went in baggage or box-express cars in passenger trains. The Railway Express Agency was something like modern UPS, although you could ship larger things via REA than you can UPS. I've read that families that spent seasons in Maine or Florida would ship their household effects to their summer or winter homes via REA. LCL was different -- that could be the stove or refrigerator, or a crated bicycle, or whatever. Those went in a dedicated boxcar on a local freight. I'm pretty sure that REA express items -- trunks, parcels, etc -- would go from the baggage car to the express room at the depot, which was not the same as the freight house. LCL would probably be unloaded at the trackside freight shed, although this would be at a smaller station. I think at a station with a dedicated freight house, the LCL would go into the freight house from the dedicated LCL box car.

For that matter, LCL ran in its own national network via the individual railroads. It was sorted and reloaded at large freight houses in the cities. Some railroads had box cars specially dedicated and painted for LCL service.

Back in the day you could order a stove,ice box,rocking chair etc from a catalog and it would arrive on the local passenger train.The item was unloaded and the agent would call or send somebody out to tell you that your shipment has arrived.

This was not a REA shipment but,a regular railroad express shipment-not a LCL shipment.

Also freight houses would unload fully loaded cars for off line customers..

[jwb]

According to Wikipedia at <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railway_Express_Agency">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railway_Express_Agency</a><!-- m --> "The Railway Express Agency (REA) was a national monopoly set up by the United States federal government in 1917. Rail express services provided small package and parcel transportation using the extant railroad infrastructure much as UPS functions today using the road system. The United States government was concerned about the rapid, safe movement of parcels, money, and goods during World War I and REA was its solution to this problem." It also says, "REA was owned by 86 railroads in proportion to the express traffic on their lines - no one railroad or group of railroads had control of the agency. In response to customer demand, REA added a Chicago, Illinois-based refrigerator car line. In 1927, REA began an Air Express Division.[3] In 1938, the remainder of Southern Express also joined the consolidated REA." In other words, for most of the period we're interested in, all the railroads that mattered owned REA. Express service was NOT the same as checked baggage service and was NOT, NOT the same as LCL. It's true that for any of these, the station would call you for a pickup, but that doesn't mean they were all the same. But also, this site <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.philmont.org/history0609.html">http://www.philmont.org/history0609.html</a><!-- m --> says "To the individual, the access to LCL (less than carload) freight shipment meant that large personal goods ordered by mail and items not suitable for mailing could be sent and received quickly and safely. " Rail publicity films I've seen from the 1930s and 40s give as examples of LCL shipments stoves and crated bicycles.

While this isn't real, real important in the overall scheme of things, everything I've seen suggests that a stove or refrigerator (although refrigerators were late for LCL or express in any case) would have come by LCL, not express. They were too big and heavy to go express. The railraods, with few exceptions, after the late 19th century handled express via separate express companies, and after WWI this was American Railway Express/Railway Express Agency. The railroads did not, and could not, compete with these agencies. LCL handled large mail-order items like stoves and bicycles. Express handled trunks and parcels. Checked baggage handled the same sort of luggage passengers still check on airlines.

[Brakie]

The first refrigerator started showing up in 1918.My grandparents bought one in 1936..It arrived by PRR in a baggage/express car and was unloaded at the Columbus Union Station..Grandpa drove his 34 Ford pickup to pick it the freight shed.I remember the story well because Grandma been wanting one for two years.

Even with REA railroad would accept express shipments and would deliver them (for a small fee) in their delivery trucks.

A lot of household goods was shipped by rail in baggage/express cars.It was very common.

Again these was not LCL shipments.

[jwb]

OK, but REA would have gone to the express room, not the freight shed -- and how do you know it arrived in a baggage/express car if the car was long gone when your grandparents picked it up?

And the railroads did not accept express shipments outside of REA. If you went down to the station or anywhere else, you were sending it REA. The railroads had no separate facilities. Remember that many stations had REA signs!

[sailormatlac]

Is that what we call a train geeks battle? Quite interesting though. Anyway, it's fun to learn from people having memories from back then, much more lively.

Just to make sure I'm not wrong, REA parcel would have been handled/stored at the passenger station depot room? LCL to the freightshed, maybe express shipment via the railroad itself too?

About LCL unloaded at the freight station, am I wrong if I say it was a freight or mixed train that pulled that car there?

BTW, REA didn't exist in Canada. However, we often since those nicely painted express boxcar in CNR and CPR steam era picture. Was it a kind of equivalent to REA, but entirely own by its own railroad (that would have been quite possible since both were transcontinental and able to handle such traffic by themselves back then)?

All that talk remembers me that parcel I once tracked. It went from New York to Texas then back to Montreal and Quebec City... Freight air cargo is sometimes puzzling but I guess it works. Did this kind of seemingly irrational travel pattern happened when parcels were handled by trains?

Matt