logging 4-6-0
#1
hey everyone,due to the recent post about bowsers steam kits being discontinued,im buying a few locos and was wondering,could i get away with having a 4-6-0 as my logging "mainline" loco? i know its older style and it would fit into a 1940's scene but i didnt know if they used them or not.thanks.--josh
Women may not find you handsome,but they'll atleast find you handy--Red Green
C&O ALL THE WAY--[Image: chessie.gif]
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#2
The J. H. Chambers Lumber Co. used a 4-4-0, into the 1930's. The Sugar Pine Lumber Co. had a 2-10-2T, through the late 1920's, 1930's.
Unless you are modeling a prototype lumber company,that used only shays, and climaxes, I see no reason why you couldn't run a ten wheeler.
When I get the paint done, I'll post the SHLC 2-6-6-2T, with its new vanderbilt tender.
I got log bunks on the four ERTL flats, and log loads for each. I have to work up the log loads for the Rivarossi log cars.
As I said in another post, I'm doing more building now.
We always learn far more from our own mistakes, than we will ever learn from another's advice.
The greatest place to live life, is on the sharp leading edge of a learning curve.
Lead me not into temptation.....I can find it myself!
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#3
i guess your right sumpter,i always loiked the ook of ten wheelers,plus its a bowser and i know there good loco kits.i hope to order it soon along with a mountain and a pacific that ill letter for the C&O.i just need to find a name for my logging railroad,i was looking at steaminthewoods but they didnt help me much ,so any ideas are welcome Misngth --josh
Women may not find you handsome,but they'll atleast find you handy--Red Green
C&O ALL THE WAY--[Image: chessie.gif]
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#4
also,if anyone could help me find out what the dimentions are for the bowser 4-6-0 it would be great.i need basic stuff like driver dia. boiler size,etc.this is because i have never detailed a steam engine or had to build one up to match a prototype so im trying to find pics of a logging 4-6-0 to go by as i buy parts for it from cal-scale,since i figured id get everything i need all in one place.of course pics of a similar engine would help ALOT.thanks.--josh
Women may not find you handsome,but they'll atleast find you handy--Red Green
C&O ALL THE WAY--[Image: chessie.gif]
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#5
Quote:i just need to find a name for my logging railroad
My SHLC, Shinnecock Hills Lumber Company, is named for Shinnecock Hills, L.I., Ny., which in turn was named for the native American tribe that lived there, and still exist on the reservation there.
The joke in selecting that name is that there is no commercial lumbering in that area.
That said, you can research a prototype logging road that is close to where you model, or you can "freelance" the name. You have a number of lakes, close that you could use, Winton, Sharon, East Fork, Rocky Fork, Stonelick, Caeser Creek, or all kinds of small towns.......your choice.
We always learn far more from our own mistakes, than we will ever learn from another's advice.
The greatest place to live life, is on the sharp leading edge of a learning curve.
Lead me not into temptation.....I can find it myself!
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#6
They offer two 4-6-0s...
one looks like a harriman (SP/UP/IC) locomotive and was originally from Varney. They call it the "Casey Jones ten-wheeler"...but it isn't close to his 1890s express 4-6-0.

There other is a Pennsy G5. It probably has 69" drivers (68" is correct, but Bowser doesn't offer those...and its pretty tough to tell in HO and it would vary slightly on the real thing based on the wear/replacement of the tires).

I suspect that the "Casey Jones" would be the better for you, since it is less distinct and an earlier design...but it might need more detailing help than the G5.

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Michael
My primary goal is a large Oahu Railway layout in On3
My secondary interests are modeling the Denver, South Park, & Pacific in On3 and NKP in HO
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#7
thanks guys,nkp,the casey jones is the one i was looking at as its quite a bit more old-timey Misngth ,but thats why i needed some sort of reference pics so i could detail it appropriatley for a 1940's era logging road.as for the name im still not sure,i kinda wanted it to be funny,but i guess that would get old pretty quick Goldth . maybe something like mount (insert name) logging company.i dont know,it an wait.till then,i have a 4-6-0 to buy Thumbsup --josh
Women may not find you handsome,but they'll atleast find you handy--Red Green
C&O ALL THE WAY--[Image: chessie.gif]
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#8
Bigsteel Wrote:but thats why i needed some sort of reference pics so i could detail it appropriatley for a 1940's era logging road.as for the name im still not sure,i kinda wanted it to be funny,but i guess that would get old pretty quick Goldth . maybe something like mount (insert name) logging company.

Josh, I suggest checking out the narrow gauge & short line gazette. They carry it at Johnny's. I have most issues from the 1980s. You are welcome to stop by sometime if you'd like to study them (I live near UC). Many real logging railroads had fine names. Perhaps you could also consider some historic local road names for inspiration...

a few ideas from me: The College Hill Logging Co, the Little Miami Lumber Line, the Mt. Healthy Lumber Co, etc. I would generally recommend looking for info on short lines of the 1940s to get an idea as to how to detail here. An HO catalog from Precision Scale is probably in order (I only have the O scale version), as well as Cal-scale and the Backshop. Keystone, Grandt Line, Rio Grande Models, and Wiseman Model Services probably have plenty of goodies as well.

Michael
Michael
My primary goal is a large Oahu Railway layout in On3
My secondary interests are modeling the Denver, South Park, & Pacific in On3 and NKP in HO
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://thesouthparkline.blogspot.com/">http://thesouthparkline.blogspot.com/</a><!-- m -->
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#9
4-6-0's were generally known as good 'dual purpose' engines. Are you planning on hauling any passengers?

Just a few cents worth...I second the Casey Jones suggestions.

I can't seem to recall if it was the Little River Logging outfit or some other, but I think it was back in the Carolinas they ran a very small 4-6-2 Pacific! A google search would probably turn up more info. I've never seen any pacific outside of brass that isn't USRA. Even the 'light' pacifics might be too heavy over the drivers for logging rail.

But, if you're into kitbashing or heavily modifying steam, then bringing the offset driver spacing on the Casey Jones closer together may just get you room for a trailing truck. It makes sense on a logging road since turning facilities took space and were often permanant features whereas so many logging branches were temporary until the area was logged out. The trailing trucks would provide better steering in reverse and serve that purpose moreso than supporting any additional firebox width/weight. This is why the 2-6-6-2's, 2-8-2's, 2-6-2's etc. had that '2' on either end of the driver number.

Galen
I may not be a rivet counter, but I sure do like rivets!
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#10
ocalicreek Wrote:I can't seem to recall if it was the Little River Logging outfit or some other, but I think it was back in the Carolinas they ran a very small 4-6-2 Pacific! A google search would probably turn up more info. I've never seen any pacific outside of brass that isn't USRA. Even the 'light' pacifics might be too heavy over the drivers for logging rail.

Galen,
You remember it correctly. The Little River did have a 4-6-2. It wasn't really a pacific. It had a 4-wheel lead truck, but the 2-wheel rear truck was for tracking, not for supporting a larger firebox. The pacific design was to add a firebox to a ten wheeler (the same reason that the British "Baltics" were NOT hudsons). Still, the Little River 4-6-2 is usually called the smallest standard gauge pacific in the US. Not only are the drivers smaller than those of the EBT 2-8-2s, but its smaller than the big EBT 2-8-2s IIRC. The Little River also had the 2-4-4-2 which has been modeled a number of times. The first one was too large, so a second was ordered. I'll be seeing the Little River 4-6-2 for the first time in my life this summer...she's in Michigan. One of our members, his name has his Ham radio call sign as his name and Cartman as his avatar, is a member of the Little River museum in Tennessee.
Michael
My primary goal is a large Oahu Railway layout in On3
My secondary interests are modeling the Denver, South Park, & Pacific in On3 and NKP in HO
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://thesouthparkline.blogspot.com/">http://thesouthparkline.blogspot.com/</a><!-- m -->
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#11
Quote:You remember it correctly. The Little River did have a 4-6-2. It wasn't really a pacific. It had a 4-wheel lead truck, but the 2-wheel rear truck was for tracking, not for supporting a larger firebox.

Just as I suspected (the trailing truck, that is). Thanks for the confirmation, and for reminding me that she's still around. Good to see unique steam preserved.

I've got a Tyco/Mantua 2-6-2 Prairie which will someday belong to the Big Tujunga Lumber Company roster. It was my first kit-built steam engine. IMO it needs a straight boiler (vs the slight taper on the model) and a lowered boiler. With a new boiler (scratch, most likely) it wouldn't be too hard to add a 4 wheel truck up front....hmmm....

The Chehalis Centralia tourist line near here runs an old logging 2-8-2 (Baldwin product, I believe) and Mount Rainier Scenic has got a 2-8-2T, but I've never been up close and personal with a 4-6-2 of any sort, logging or otherwise.

Anyway, not to hijack the thread, but I'll check a few resources to see if I've got any pictures of 10 wheelers in logging service.

Galen
I may not be a rivet counter, but I sure do like rivets!
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#12
Galen,
If you check the bottom of this thread:
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You'll see plans for the only 3' gauge 4-8-0s ever to run in the US. They were essentially 2-8-0s with a 4-wheel lead truck. Since you're doing that sort of thing.

Logging lines and short lines frequently had all sorts of similar conversions. The Colorado Springs & Cripple Creek District Railway had four 2-6-2s which were essentially just 0-6-0s with extra wheels. One was even converted to a 2-6-0 which demonstrated not only that the extra axle was not integral to the design, but also that it really served no purpose. The Hilo Railroad had an ex-Sierra 2-6-2 which was also little more than an 0-6-0 with extra wheels. I'm sure there were many other examples.

You need to get up the SF...IIRC, there have been three operational Southern Pacific pacifics in the past 10 years. (I admit, half the reason I typed that was to say: Southern Pacific pacifics...it is nearly as good as talking about Southern pacifics 35 )
Michael
My primary goal is a large Oahu Railway layout in On3
My secondary interests are modeling the Denver, South Park, & Pacific in On3 and NKP in HO
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://thesouthparkline.blogspot.com/">http://thesouthparkline.blogspot.com/</a><!-- m -->
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#13
Josh: lots of name ideas just in your area.
What's the name of the hill going south of Cincinnati across the river?
There are: Sugar Tree Ridge, Cedar Grove, Brush Creek S. F. (lots of fresh timber there), Dry Ridge.
An old 4-6-0 would be quite natural for the main line; it might not be suitable in the mountains.
I just noticed Rio Grande in Ohio. You can buy pre-lettered locos and cars!
David
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