A new poll for the newer Big Blue members.... an update for the long time members!

Recently, it seems that several Toronto-area hobby shops have either closed or converted into being online stores. In one case, one moved from a downtown Toronto neighbourhood to just outside of the city because it was more economical (George's Trains). I apologize in advance if this topic has been flogged to death in the past! but I'm asking it again here because it suddenly seems that the storefront type of LHS is quickly disappearing in favour of the online version.

I'm aware of the cost/economical reasons for this -- I just thought it would be very interesting to poll our members here and see if there is a pattern. I definitely fall into the "both" category, although I also seem to be buying more online lately. This is partly because of our high Canadian dollar -- it's currently very economical for Canadians to buy from the US or UK (I had another thread on this!)

I mainly support my LHS's but have recently bought more online. For example, I recently went into one of my LHS's asking for some back-scenes for a small British shelf layout I'm working on. They didn't have any but offered to order some in. I declined because I was pretty confident they would take weeks (even months?) to arrive. Instead, I bought some online and they arrived in 4-5 days! I think this is a good case in point.

At any rate, I look forward to any feedback!

Rob

I deal totally with local hobby shops, but I'm fortunate that here in So Cal we have an abundance of good train shops. In fact here one local hobby shop is a general source stocking rc cars, boats, planes as well as trains, but the other store I deal with specializes in trains only. I think a lot of the hobby shops that are starting to do business online are not closing the brick and mortar store so much as adding an online web site in addition to the local store. Online has become the new "mail order", and a lot of local hobby shops are discovering that they can increase their customer base. The other thing I've noticed is a lot of local hobby shops selling at train shows. I've particularly noticed some hobby shops from California's central coast area (between Santa Barbara and San Jose for those not familiar with Ca.) are using train shows to expand their customer base. Some of these stores are located in towns so small that there is probably not enough of a population base to support a store in town, but by selling at the shows as well, they increase sales to the point of being able to compete in volume with stores from the larger cities.

I've never purchased online and always go to my LHS's but my wife has bought me model railroad gifts online. I guess I enjoy actually seeing the item on a shelf.
Ralph

I used to deal exclusively with the local hobby shops, but long before the Internet they seemed to think they had a captive buyers mart. The prices got to be too high for my budget so I started mail order. At that time I was buying 4 Athearn locomotives for the price I paid for 1 at the LHS.
Having been in retail sales for a long time, I understand you have to make a buck, but I also understand that you have to be competitive too. If you can't make a profit selling at 100 percent mark-up, you aren't ever going to make it. Most modelers want what they want now, not in a week or two.
My nearest hobby shop is 23 miles. If I go there for and item and he doesn't have it, that is 46 miles wasted, and if I order and go back that is a hundred miles of travel, and at the cost of driving at 40 cents a mile or better that is 40 dollars, which will pay a lot of shipping and handling and I get most orders in 2 days and the worst is 5 days, so I guess that is why I'm called cheap chuck.
I also like the Idea of shopping here at home. It saves time for other things, like talking with my friends on the Gauge.
Charlie

LHS's. I want to see it, check it out, watch it run, and discuss it with the LHS pro's.

I prefer my local hobby shop(s), I've never ordered online for anything yet, but I think that will change soon when I need items that my LHS's don't have. For now though I am buying up the things I want that are in stock. I do go to many of the Local Hobby shops within 100 miles from me so I have more of a selection. I like to cruise around so If don't end up with anything I still have the nice ride

This does go for cheaper prices since I like to find the bargains

I do what I can to keep my LHS in business. They are a good bunch of guys and I want them to stay in business. Now, their selection isn't all that great, so there are times when I purchase online or if I am looking for older stuff, I'll check out Ebay.

A few years ago, there was another shop nearby that had a great selection - old, new, consignment, lots of stuff. But he moved to Colorado = closed down shop here. The current LHS pretty much charges MSRP. However - I will soon be in the market for 300 feet of flex track and cork roadbed, a couple dozen turn-outs, kadee electromagnets, etc for the layout expansion. What I'll do is give them a list of what I need and see what kind of quantity discount they will give me. Surely they know what this stuff sells for on the net. And even at net prices, they can still make some money off me with the large quantity.

I would like to do 100% LHS. One of my LHS changed owners, the new guy is less friendly, plus they started keeping much less inventory (sometimes being out of stock of simple track components). And then they moved to the suburbs. I haven't been there since. I have another LHS that is mostly R/C, but I go there for paint supplies and basic hobby supplies. They actually have quite a few of the basic train supplies, but I rarely buy train stuff there. There is also a LHS that sells only narrow gauge stuff. If I had more money, I would buy quite a bit from there. But right now, i buy mostly detail parts rail, and ties. I only shop online when 1) I can't obtain it easily through the LHS 2) I can get significant savings online. I would much rather support the local economy than some far-away place or my arch enemies UPS or FedEx.

We no longer have a hobby shop here in town and the nearest is 45 to 50 miles away. Yes, I buy on-line as well as from my LHS.

Gary S Wrote:I do what I can to keep my LHS in business. They are a good bunch of guys and I want them to stay in business. Now, their selection isn't all that great, so there are times when I purchase online or if I am looking for older stuff, I'll check out Ebay.

A few years ago, there was another shop nearby that had a great selection - old, new, consignment, lots of stuff. But he moved to Colorado = closed down shop here. The current LHS pretty much charges MSRP. However - I will soon be in the market for 300 feet of flex track and cork roadbed, a couple dozen turn-outs, kadee electromagnets, etc for the layout expansion. What I'll do is give them a list of what I need and see what kind of quantity discount they will give me. Surely they know what this stuff sells for on the net. And even at net prices, they can still make some money off me with the large quantity.

Gary, I just got 200 sections of Model Power Flex track from Trainworld. It is not as flexible as Atlas, (I think that is a plus). It was $189 per 100 sections, and I added 20 pairs of KD's to put the total to just over $400 to get $40 dollars off on the Presidents Day sale. The 2 hobby shops here wanted 4.95 a section, and 7.95 a section (no quantity discount) (that was for Atlas) .
Model Power has both 83 and 100. I stayed with 100 because I have loads of turnouts and other flex to add.
Charlie

I had to vote for online shopping as I have no LHS with US equipment anymore. Only some paint, glue etc. is still bought local.
We have 5 nice shops shops with remarkable amount of US equipment in Germany I use frequently. The nearest is a two hour drive. All 5 have good online shops. They get about 60% of my volume. The rest is directly from the US (about §30 shipping cost per parcel!) and 1-2% for paint and glue from the LHS.

But I agree, a LHS should be supported if possible. My LHS was extrem helpful when I converted from DC to DCC some years ago (with a German layout). I got the control unit, power pack and three engines with DCC decoders for a test run over the weekend for free. The weekend was a great success and I spend a lot of money on Monday afternoon The same happened with the airbrush compressor. I was concerned about the noise and got it for a test run. I kept it and payed. The LHS is not a discount store but the owner understands the business and support me very well. I had never a problem to pay the (extra) price for that service.

Could you imagine the trouble if you buy a DCC starter set and find out you don't like DCC at all or get a very loud compressor and your wife is jelling on you due to the noise. I am a fan of my LHS (having no US equipment)

My 'local' hobby shop is nearly 5 hours away from me by car, or it would be if I had a car.

Charlie B Wrote:

Gary S Wrote:I just got 200 sections of Model Power Flex track from Trainworld. It is not as flexible as Atlas, (I think that is a plus). It was $189 per 100 sections

Charlie, now you have gone and caused me some "what should I do" issues! I was all set to buy Atlas Code 83 flex, but the MP price has me wondering if I should go with that. My old layout which will be reused has Atlas track. Should I mix MP into that?

Both.

I make the regular Saturday morning trip almost every weekend for the 9am opening at George's Trains in Markham. Its the best time for me to go, hardly any traffic and the family likes to sleep in on the weekends. I usually end up picking up something, even if its just some strip wood or a couple jars of paint. Most of my rolling stock has been purchased from the LHS, although I have found some really nice resin kits on-line from direct sources I may purchase in the near future. My locos were all bought on e-bay for a song. Something I could not pass up. Plus my track building supplies, rail, jigs, wood ties, all bought direct from Fast Tracks. I've also used Black Bear Construction Co. to purchase bass wood on-line. They sell it 24" lengths which I'm finding out is quite practical when building large wood structures and you want to keep joints to a minimum.

Although, I do occasionally check out e-bay, and on-line sales to see what is available and if it is cost effective to order on-line when adding up shipping et al. An example of this is when I was shopping around for a sound decoder. After doing some quick math, I found that it was just as affordable if not a bit cheaper to get one from my LHS directly as opposed to buying on-line. So the next Tsunami I buy will most likely be from George's.

My last few purchases has been local since I didn't need that much-that will include 1 Atlas HO tank car.Since I don't really need that much more I will probably be buying more from the local shops.