RobertInOntario Wrote:Hopefully, some of these increases will be overturned -- at least we can hope they will!
In any case, if these increases are still going through (even if they're lower than 16%), there must be some good ways to reduce energy consumption.
Rob, because everybody has cut back on their electrical consumption, the price of hydro had to rise in order to cover all those bloated salaries and that obscene pension for their last CEO. They're still making the power, but because everybody has cut back, they're running out of room in which to store the excess. The only way to bring the price back down is to use
more power, so turn up the heat, crank up the air conditioner and, for some pleasant background noise while running trains, turn on the clothes dryer.
Wayne
doctorwayne Wrote:RobertInOntario Wrote:Hopefully, some of these increases will be overturned -- at least we can hope they will!
In any case, if these increases are still going through (even if they're lower than 16%), there must be some good ways to reduce energy consumption.
Rob, because everybody has cut back on their electrical consumption, the price of hydro had to rise in order to cover all those bloated salaries and that obscene pension for their last CEO. They're still making the power, but because everybody has cut back, they're running out of room in which to store the excess. The only way to bring the price back down is to use more power, so turn up the heat, crank up the air conditioner and, for some pleasant background noise while running trains, turn on the clothes dryer.
Wayne
Interesting! But it sounds like a risk -- that I'd risk getting stuck with an extra-high electricity bill!
At any rate, maybe I have been doing this with out A/C cranked up so much. We've had it cranked up again this weekend.
Rob
doctorwayne Wrote:RobertInOntario Wrote:Hopefully, some of these increases will be overturned -- at least we can hope they will!
In any case, if these increases are still going through (even if they're lower than 16%), there must be some good ways to reduce energy consumption.
Rob, because everybody has cut back on their electrical consumption, the price of hydro had to rise in order to cover all those bloated salaries and that obscene pension for their last CEO. They're still making the power, but because everybody has cut back, they're running out of room in which to store the excess. The only way to bring the price back down is to use more power, so turn up the heat, crank up the air conditioner and, for some pleasant background noise while running trains, turn on the clothes dryer.
Wayne
That won't ever happen under any circumstances. When is the last time you saw a decrease in the price of a cup of coffee at your local restaurant? Every time the price of coffee increases, they increase their prices, when coffee prices drop in the stores (and distribution), they keep the price the same, seeing as how you have become use to the higher prices. The same goes for electricity, water and natural gas, with the fact that these people have the blessing of the corporation commission to back up their increases. Once an increase is approved and put in place, they're not going to drop for any reason, just like taxes. Around here, they built a nuclear power plant about 20 years ago. The day they opened, they added a couple of dollars to our monthly bill to cover the cost of dismantling it when the time comes. I'll lay you odds, when that happens, that charge will still be there. Around here, the electric company also runs ads on all our local TV stations several times a day, touting the use of energy efficient products. You know, of course, who pays for all those ads...
Yeah, we've worked hard for the little we were able to retire with so we plan on enjoying it while we can. We save where we can, but we're not setting anything aside for our kids to inherit. When the money runs out, we'll just lay down in the middle of the street and wait for someone to come pick us up.
In the meantime, we don't worry about such things as how much power do we use with that extra refrigerator in the garage, or what does it cost to keep our house cool in the summer, and especially what does our fun hobbies cost us? We are careful and concerned, we just don't worry or go without.
Don, Rob,
Re: increases. What Don describes is exactly what happened to the water rate here in Ottawa. For years they kept telling us to cut back on water and save. Now the revenue has dropped to the point that they have to increase the rate to support all the costs. So we conserved to the point that we got higher prices.
Andrew
MasonJar Wrote:... re: [All Utility Rate and "necessary power-producing consumables cost"] increases. ... For years they kept telling us to cut back on water [and electricity and gasoline] and save. [So we did, we suck up, pulled in the belt and cut back our usage, esentially by lowering our lifestyle.] Now the revenue has dropped to the point that they have to increase the rate to support all the costs. So we conserved to the point that we got higher prices. ... Andrew
After taking a required Economics course in high school and Econ 101 as an elective junior year in college, I forsaw the eventual outcome of this riduculousness and never cut back a damn thing ... I did my part to consume freely and try to help keep prices low.
NEWSFLASH! The Law of Supply and Demand is reversed, turned 180, when it comes to Utilities, i.e., the less you use, the more it will cost, as production costs do not decrease but to the contrary, increase as raw materials costs and hourly employee wages increase, year after year. It is basic economics - the first class meeting of Econ 101!
So now, despite the individual efforts of a handful of us to keep prices low, the masses were sucked in to the propaganda of those who would love to see the northern half of the western hemisphere of this little rotating rock be just as poor and oppressed as the rest of the rock!
We must be punished for using our brains to devise ways to make life more comfortable and enjoying some life's little luxuries that we have developed along the way. It isn't fair that we should live as comfortably as we do when the inhabitants of poor countries, run by oppressive dictators, live in depressing hovels, enduring hard-scrabbble lives, sweating in summer and freezing in winter, with bearly enough to eat!
(... and no Lobster Thermador, Mr. President!)
I shall now step down from my Sunday morning soapbox.
Quick question - are the electrical utilities in Canada owned by "the people" i.e. the "government"?
Here's some information on the situation in the Province of Ontario:
Ontario Hydro.
Sir Adam Beck was an early proponent of low-cost electrical power to stimulate economic growth, and he championed the case of
power at cost. He's probably been rotating in his mausoleum for many years - too bad we can't hook him up to a generator.
Wayne
MAN, is the only life form ever in the history of life on Earth, that is driven not by survival, but, by the desire for profit !.
MasonJar Wrote:Don, Rob,
Re: increases. What Don describes is exactly what happened to the water rate here in Ottawa. For years they kept telling us to cut back on water and save. Now the revenue has dropped to the point that they have to increase the rate to support all the costs. So we conserved to the point that we got higher prices.
Andrew
Nobody does any "systems" thinking or analysis any more. This is what you get when you don't consider the problems with fiddling with interdependent effects in systems...you get the 'quick fix that backfires' and other unintended consequences. We are in the throes of having water meters imposed on us in the Comox/Courtenay area on Vancouver Island so that we can control use. What anyone with any brains understands will happen is that use will indeed drop, but so will the revenue to keep up the salaries and recapitalization for the water distribution infrastructure in the valley. So, rates will have to rise because revenue falls when people get the feedback from their monthly utility bills and usage figures. Is basic psychology and economics so hard to understand?
About my own power usage related to trains; the ten 50 watt mini-halogens I have mounted in twin tracks above the layout use 20 times more power at any one point in time than do the one or two engines I have pulling up the grades. The math is simple: one engine requires about 25 watts, give or take, and the lights illuminating it need 500!
-Crandell
"(Hydro One) is a crown corporation wholly owned by the Government of Ontario. Hydro One itself is a private company, however 100% of its shares are owned by the Government of Ontario."
It is a private corporation wholly owned by the government? Oxymoron! Of course, the government is The People, so if the rates skyrocket, it is because The People have deemed it so?
As for profit, it is the reason why we enjoy such a wonderfully easy life filled with luxury and free time and comfort and model trains.
MasonJar Wrote:.... Now the revenue has dropped to the point that they have to increase the rate to support all the costs. So we conserved to the point that we got higher prices.
Andrew
The exact opposite happens with public transit - the more that people use it, the higher the subsidies required to keep it operating. Which means that there's seemingly no point at which it will make money.
As for electricity costs, let's take a guess on what will happen when we all, at the government's urging, start driving electric cars. All I can say is that mine darn-well better be one that flies, too.
They've been promising them for years.
Wayne