For locos that require traction tires, is bullfrog snot a good alternative? A colleague said that it's basically the same thing as caulking,which would work just as well (and be cheaper?). Just curious if anyone can comment on these two alternatives.

Their website is quite helpful and it seems that Bullfrog Snot is easy to apply.
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Thanks, Rob

One of the Platelayers talked about using it at a recent meeting. He was quite satisfied (with the second application, I think) but commented about (1) the apparently large number of applications from the smallish bottle and (2) the large cost for a smallish bottle (maybe $25).
There was another comment somewhere about it drying out in the bottle.

I've read some reviews about Frog Snot -- it seems like good stuff. One reviewer pointed out it is not as good as a regular traction tire. If your loco wheels are grooved for traction tires, you may want to stick with them. Google frog snot and you'll find a lot of reviews about it. Personally, I thinned some silicone caulk and applied it to the drive wheels on one of my Athearn Hustlers -- works great so far. Time will tell how long it will lasts until a reapplication is needed.

Chuck

Chuck Wrote:I've read some reviews about Frog Snot -- it seems like good stuff. One reviewer pointed out it is not as good as a regular traction tire. If your loco wheels are grooved for traction tires, you may want to stick with them. Google frog snot and you'll find a lot of reviews about it. Personally, I thinned some silicone caulk and applied it to the drive wheels on one of my Athearn Hustlers -- works great so far. Time will tell how long it will lasts until a reapplication is needed.

Chuck

Thanks, Chuck. I think that's what my friend was recommending -- silicon caulk. However, this loco does have grooves for tires so maybe it is better to go that route. Rob

BR60103 Wrote:One of the Platelayers talked about using it at a recent meeting. He was quite satisfied (with the second application, I think) but commented about (1) the apparently large number of applications from the smallish bottle and (2) the large cost for a smallish bottle (maybe $25).
There was another comment somewhere about it drying out in the bottle.

Yes, the cost did take me by surprise. $25 or so for something you might only use 1-2 times, and even then it might not work that well. Rob

I use bullfrog snot on my AEM7/ALP44 fleet, as well as some of my other locomotives. These small engines were either hauling a 13 car Amtrak train or constantly running back and forth as part of a commuter train on our club's open house season.

In particular, my ALP44 ran on the same application of bullfrog snot for almost three years. This allowed the little engine to pull more prototypical sized trains.

Here is what I have learned-

• I have not had it dry up in the bottle, and I bought mine a few years ago.
  
• This is NOT something you use once or twice. It really needs to be removed and reapplied periodically.
  
• It will wear down after a while as I have learned with my ALP44.
  
• It WILL collect dirt, and it won't let go. It should be fine for a while, but there is a point where it will need to be removed and reapplied due to dirt.
  
• Care needs to be taken when applied to steam locomotives, so that it does not get caught in the side rods, for obvious reasons.
  
• It pays to have a cradle and some method for keeping the engine running while upside down while applying it
  
• It can be a little tricky to apply. Its a little tacky, and sometimes tends to clump. I flat bladed screw drive helps smooth it as the wheel spins
  
• That same flat bladed screw driver can also remove the bullfrog snot if necessary.

Green_Elite_Cab Wrote:I use bullfrog snot on my AEM7/ALP44 fleet, as well as some of my other locomotives. These small engines were either hauling a 13 car Amtrak train or constantly running back and forth as part of a commuter train on our club's open house season.

In particular, my ALP44 ran on the same application of bullfrog snot for almost three years. This allowed the little engine to pull more prototypical sized trains.

Here is what I have learned-

• I have not had it dry up in the bottle, and I bought mine a few years ago.
  
• This is NOT something you use once or twice. It really needs to be removed and reapplied periodically.
  
• It will wear down after a while as I have learned with my ALP44.
  
• It WILL collect dirt, and it won't let go. It should be fine for a while, but there is a point where it will need to be removed and reapplied due to dirt.
  
• Care needs to be taken when applied to steam locomotives, so that it does not get caught in the side rods, for obvious reasons.
  
• It pays to have a cradle and some method for keeping the engine running while upside down while applying it
  
• It can be a little tricky to apply. Its a little tacky, and sometimes tends to clump. I flat bladed screw drive helps smooth it as the wheel spins
  
• That same flat bladed screw driver can also remove the bullfrog snot if necessary.

Thanks -- this is helpful and clear up several questions I had. Still trying to decide between tires and this option though!

Good news. I bought a tube of silicon caulking from Home Depot for about $4.00 and "painted" some of this onto the traction grooves of this loco using an old paint brush, and let it dry overnight.

It now runs and pulls two coaches easily. It hauled 3 OK but started to derail ether pulling 4. The only problem is that it's a little jerky and doesn't run as smoothly as it used to. This is probably b/c it needs some running in and b/c the caulking needs to be smoothed out a little more, removing some unneeded clumps, etc. (Or, perhaps I should have done a neater job in the beginning!)

At any rate, the problem is solved although this might be temporary (b/c the caulking could wear off easily) and might need re-applying at some point. Bull-Frog Snot or traction tyres are probably still a better long-term solution.

Thanks for your help with this.

Rob

I have wondered about electrical pickup.

I have wondered about electrical pickup.

Bullfrog Snot doesn't have electrical pickup. That might have been nice, but its best to only apply it to one wheel set, and one is really all you need.

I haven't had any trouble with applying bullfrog snot, it doesn't tend to go on chunky. Essentially, you take a little bit, and with the engine running upside down, spread it on the wheel tread. Then you just let it run upside down for 15 minutes, running full tilt. The centrifugal force will smooth out the wheel. After that, just let the model sit over night (with the treated wheelset not touching anything), and it should harden nice and smooth.

My caulking solution is working reasonably well, although the wheels are a little gooey with some grunge building up. I'm viewing this as a short-term solution thinking that the bullfrog snot will be a much better option. Seems like it's easier and cleaner to apply (ie less messy).

Yes, you only apply it (either the caulking or bullfrog snot) to one wheel set and that's enough to give the loco more pulling power. The other wheels will do the electrical pickup.

My loco is wobbling a little and not as smooth as it used to be, again because the caulking is messy and uneven.

Rob

I stay clear of tires and snot. I found that stuff tends to give me more track to clean, I hate cleaning track. I must be old fashioned, because I stick with the idea of just cramming as much weight over the drivers as possible. That's what works in the real world of railroading, and it works for me in the HO world also ( I can't speak for smaller scales) . If that doesn't solve the problem,,, some work to the rolling stock may be in order to get them to roll more freely. If slipping trains are still a problem,, call in a helper. That's another real-world fix that works in the miniature world of model railroading. Think of how often do you see trains running with just one unit at the point. In GEC's example this isn't always a good fix, most commuter lines only use 1 loco per train. Remember trains loose traction and slip and stall in the real world all the time, especially steam power starting a heavy train, so you can always take the easy way out and just say it's prototypical .

e-paw Wrote:I stay clear of tires and snot. I found that stuff tends to give me more track to clean, I hate cleaning track. I must be old fashioned, because I stick with the idea of just cramming as much weight over the drivers as possible. That's what works in the real world of railroading, and it works for me in the HO world also ( I can't speak for smaller scales) . If that doesn't solve the problem,,, some work to the rolling stock may be in order to get them to roll more freely. If slipping trains are still a problem,, call in a helper. That's another real-world fix that works in the miniature world of model railroading. Think of how often do you see trains running with just one unit at the point. In GEC's example this isn't always a good fix, most commuter lines only use 1 loco per train. Remember trains loose traction and slip and stall in the real world all the time, especially steam power starting a heavy train, so you can always take the easy way out and just say it's prototypical .

Thanks... The weight idea usually helps. But this is such a small tank engine that it might benefit from both weights and caulking/snot and weights. Another problem is that it can be tricky finding a place to install the weights, especially over the wheels.

e-paw that is a weighty suggestion, which is my normal way of doing things. I was just curious about it. I only have traction problem with three locomotives one one grade. A helper will take care of that. Also as you said, it is a more prototypical way of doing it.