GEC's Layout Progress - Printable Version

GEC's Layout Progress - Printable Version

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Re: GEC's Layout Progress - jwb - 04-02-2014

EMD diesels were used in one type of WWII submarine. F-Ms were in the other, which is what inspired F-M to build locomotives after the war. I believe EMDs were in some railroad tugs, which makes sense.

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Ralph - 04-02-2014

I'd heard that about the tugs.

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Green_Elite_Cab - 04-02-2014

Indeed, all of those crates are labeled "US Navy", so that does make a lot of sense.

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - e-paw - 04-06-2014

Nice job on the Geeps. Thumbsup

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Charlie B - 04-07-2014

Many of the LST's had EMD engines too.
Charlie

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Green_Elite_Cab - 04-09-2014

Some more progress on my geeps-

NJ DOT GP7 #5681-

I added the Plano intakes, A-200 horns, spark arrestors, the cab signal box, the "mystery box" above it, and the bell mount. I scratch built the bell mount from thin styrene following the exact same pattern as the real one. Mind bendingly difficult? definitely, but i think the results were worth it. The only issue is that the metal bell casting from the Custom Finishing piece looks a bit to big, so I might have to find a smaller bell and use that.

Also somewhat frustrating was the cab signal box housing. I'll probably pull the box out and redo it. The main problem is that the deck is getting so thin that its breaking relatively easily, and I've already had to replace part of it with styrene because is snapped off into oblivion.

That said, most of the "heavy duty" details have been added now, and certainly all the CNJ specific details. I can now begin adding some of the minor parts that came with the kit so that I can get it ready for painting.

Apart from the pilots, which need to be rebuilt, the only other details I need to add are the body louvers present on both sides of the short hood. Plano makes SW louvers that should be close enough, so I'll have my LHS order them. I'll mount them on a plate made from super thin styrene, and that should look right on the model.

The only major challenge to getting an accurate GP7 pilot. Unfortunately, though almost all the other details of the P2k GP7 were correct for this CNJ unit, the pilots are not correct. The P2k GP18 has the correct pilot for itself and the GP7, and so I'll probably use that as a guide while I chisel and drill the pilots. I was hoping someone might make the pilot as a separate part, but I can't find one specific for the GP7, though there are many for other EMD types.

The scratchbuilt bell housing. I used thicker styrene to make the upside down "L", and then super thin styrene for the side pieces. I then sanded things down once it was a solid piece. I even put brace "behind" the bell to the hood, which took some shaping with jewelers files to match the profile.

Here is the cab signal box area. I still have no idea what the "white box" is for. It appears to only be present on CNJ 1523/ NJT 5681. I might need to file it down to be a little more square, but its only held on by micro crystal clear, so I can remove it if I need to.

You can see that the walkway above the cab signal box is a little rough, and so I might try to hone it down a little more. This area has become very delicate, even though I've mounted the deck piece to it directly to give it strength. A chunk had to be filled in with some conveniently sized styrene I had on hand.

I'm thinking I'm going to have to fill in the "center" parts of this rear housing as well. this area is definitely smooth on the prototype, and I worry that I won't be able to live with the seem once I paint it.

It definitely seems like the Plano intake grills and shudders were a valid investment! As long as it doesn't get clogged with paint, these will look fantastic. You'll notice both models even have the "drains" in the bottom of the radiator screens, something not present on the cast on detail.

Radiator intakes on the GP7

The shudders needed to be folded from a brass sheet. Once folded, the shudders can be adjusted to be open or closed. They are open in this photo, but i made mine mostly closed.

I drilled out the original radiator screens, and test fit the shudders before I removed the "frame" of the cast on intakes. The frame worked as a guide for making a "square" opening for the shudders. Once I was satisfied, I used #17 chisel blade to carefully scrape the frame away, and a sanding stick to smooth out the area beneath it.

Conrail GP18 #7499

I didn't do as much to the GP18, but then it doesn't need a whole lot of significant modification, with one major exception. The LV GP18s had a smaller fuel tank than the stock GP18. There is a noticeable gap between the air reservoirs and the back of the fuel tank, and so this needs to be cut. The main problem is that it cuts through some of the motor mounts. there should still be enough of a mount there to hold the motor in place, it just won't have the back two mounts unless I find a different method (screws maybe?).

In any event, I added a "stand in" horn until I can find a better casting. The stock horn had two bells facing forward, and I just cut the large bell and reversed it, flipping the horn around to look close to the prototype's. It is only press fit in, so I can replace it when I find a better horn.

I also added the plano intakes, which again, look fantastic.

At this point I can go ahead and start adding in some of the "stock" details that came with the GP18, and get ready to paint it. The only frustrating issue is that the model was OLD, and it looks like someone broke the tabs on the rear of the shell, which is why the deck seems to sag a little. I'll have to "make" my own, if possible.

Intakes on the GP18. These were a little easier to apply, except for the rain gutters that had to be glued in place. The GP18 came with its own shudders.

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Rscott417 - 04-11-2014

Really nice, I've always thought about adding more realistic grilles but don't know how I feel about making those major cuts into the shell.

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Green_Elite_Cab - 04-11-2014

Rscott417 Wrote:Really nice, I've always thought about adding more realistic grilles but don't know how I feel about making those major cuts into the shell.

I wouldn't get to worried, they aren't really that major, just time consuming (and even then, not too terribly long).

Basically all you need to do is drill a series of small holes around the inside of what you want to open up. It helps that most screens have a little bit of a depth to them that help guide you, so its easy to put a reasonably sized drill into a pinvise and just work around the perimeter.

as long as your holes are close together (again, easy to do using the existing screen as a guide), you should be able to connect the dots really easily with a sharp knife. Once you punch out the middle (which should no longer be really attached), you just need to file or sand down the edges. Jewelers files, and a sanding stick make short work of this. If you're careful, you can even use a knife to scrape away the remainder initially so that you don't have to sand little bumps down for an eternity.

In fact, I'd be far more worried about shaving off the "frame" molded into the shell, since there its possible for the knife to slip and shave off something you don't want it to. It helps to put down some masking tape as a guide sometimes.

You'll notice in the close up shot of the GP7 Radiator intake, there are little scrapes, but in the "overall" shot, you can't even see them. You can't really see them with the model sitting there either (and I have good eyes). It might be wise to polish it, but once the paint goes on (particular, the dark blue paint of the NJ DOT), even those minor imperfections will go unnoticed.

Ultimately, its the sort of thing that after you do it a few times, no longer becomes scary.

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Mileswestern - 04-11-2014

Green_Elite_Cab Wrote:Not quite my own layout progress, but I find interesting things buried at the diesel shop I work at... While moving crates to rebuild the place, I found some EMD locomotive parts! These are WWII era surplus parts... These have been sealed for the past ~60-70 years! I guess these EMDs never caught on in marine applications.

Any chance I could get my hands on one of these boxes? How large are they?

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Green_Elite_Cab - 04-11-2014

They aren't that big, I think those boxes had piston rings in them.

I'll look around for a box that I can "liberate", but unfortunately, I think most of the boxes that are protected are still sealed up in the crates. the ones in the photo have already been out in the elements for a couple months, and they're probably still exposed. If I come across any box that I can conveniently empty, I'll let you know. It is a neat pattern on them!

Speaking of boxes..... how does this sound-

110 CARTRIDGES CAL.50
LINKED

All that is in them is a bunch of obsolete injector clamps and shims and parts we were never going to sell. They were labeled "January 1945", so these seem to be legitimate WWII Navy ammo boxes.

[Image: 56a90a7a-f4f2-4307-97e0-8e61911c342f.jpg]

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - e-paw - 04-11-2014

That's some cool stuff GEC Thumbsup

.. And the geeps are coming along nicely.
While you're looking through you EMD stash, If you come across any injectors for a 567b block let me know, our B-unit needs two of them.
Big Grin

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Green_Elite_Cab - 04-12-2014

Mileswestern Wrote:Any chance I could get my hands on one of these boxes? How large are they?

I looked today, the only easily accessible ones looked really bad. They still had integrity, but they had faded on one side from being exposed during the week. There are probably more sealed in the crates, but I won't be able to get to them for some time. I'm almost positive we will be scrapping most of those EMD parts (they are the kinds of parts like shims and things that no one ever buys, and we have thousands), so when that day comes I'll pull out a box for you.

e-paw Wrote:That's some cool stuff GEC .. And the geeps are coming along nicely.
While you're looking through you EMD stash, If you come across any injectors for a 567b block let me know, our B-unit needs two of them.

Its a good news/bad news situation.

the good news is We do have 567 injector parts, and I think we have enough to rebuild them. There is also a strong possibility that there is a complete one in a box some place that might work right out of the box.

Unfortunately, none of our EMD manuals were on site to identify specific variations, and I wasn't able to find any complete 567 injectors. That doesn't mean there aren't any in there, but I only have a very brief time to look. Most of the ones I found are 645 injectors of various types. T

Speaking of types, if you know the specific part number, let me know, since there are different injectors compatible with your engine, and so ideally they should all match. It should be stamped into the injector body.

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Green_Elite_Cab - 04-15-2014

Ugh, I've been trying to keep my spending in line, especially considering threads like This One, and the fact that there are a lot of shiny new things out there I'd really like (new Amfleets, PC and SEPTA MP54s, SDP45s).

That said, bunch of opportunites converged on me that I was (for better or for worse), unable to turn down. I managed to get a lot of new equipment for much less than the MSRP, and some of it is out of production, but I still feel that uncomfortable feeling in my gut that since none of these thing were on my "MUST HAVE" list, apart from the Reading cars, but I'll get into that in a minute.

In the meantime, I'm going to avoid buying anything else of a while.

So, here is the short list of my haul-

Conrail U25B #2582, under half price, plus a decoder.
CDOT cab car, also at a good price
A ton of bachmann EZ track, probably about $200 worth for the price of a circle of track. Included with particularly broad curves, which allow me to test engines and car that won't fit on my layout's 22" curves, without having to haul a lot of trains to my train club.
4 NJ Transit Comet VI "bilevel" coaches and 1 bi-level Cab car, with all necessary parts (which normally I'd have to buy separately) an extra decals, for less than the price per kit.
5 Reading Company MU car body shells, probably the last ones available. I plan to modify these to match the "Blueliner" rebuilds.

Those last two are going to be the more interesting projects.

NJ Transit Bi-Level train

I really hesitated buying these cars, since at least originally, they cost a lot of money per car, and did not come with the decals or wheels (and I think for a time, the windows were also separate!). However, I spotted a listing that had 5 cars, plus the wheels and decals (and then some more NJT decals for Arrow IIIs, PL42ACs, and ALP46s), all for a price per car that was less than if I bought the kits without the other parts I'd need.

Essentially, I just need to paint and decal the things, and then put them together. This whole train can be up and running by the end of the week, which is pretty good considering most of my projects drag on for months and years.

I also hesitated since these are VERY modern cars, and certainly do NOT match my late 70s modeling.

That said, I had really wanted these cars since I ride them almost every time I go to New York City, and I like them alot. I also have the modern NJT ALP46 electric, but with no modern cars appropriate for it to pull.

My main disappointment with these cars is that they have some flaws with them. The worst offender is the end profile of the car, and the "skinny" windows are also hard to swallow. There is also a lot of molded on detail that if I felt compelled to, I could scrape off and replace. Ultimately though, it looks "right" from the broadside, and just barely squeaks into my "good enough" category. I'll suspend my rivet counting tendency since these cars still look very cool.

The prototype (since I haven't yet been able to take a proper picture of the models)-

[Image: pictures%5C18929%5CIMG_1419.jpg]

[Image: pictures%5C18929%5CIMG_1419.jpg]

Future Blueliner Project

This one I'm fairly excited by. These are more Reading Company "Green car" body shells, but they won't be for long.

By 1963, the old "Green Cars" were over 30 years old (having been built in 1931-32), and the Reading wished to extend the life of the cars another 15 years while replacements were found. 38 cars were rebuilt between 1964 and 1965, and were given a fancy blue and cream paint scheme, as well as a "silverliner" style interior. This earned them the name "Blueliner".

As it turned out, only the unrebuilt green cars were retired by 1978. The Blueliners would remain in service until July 1990, lasting for 27 years rather than the planned 15! When they were retired, they were the oldest passenger cars in revenue service anywhere.

Apart from some excessively expensive brass sets, no one makes a "true" blueliner model. However, converting one of these body shells into a Blueliner shouldn't be very difficult, depending on the unit.

The only major change to all versions is the "dual" beam headlight, and the removal of the roof vents. Depending on the year, the roof-top bus connectors and insulators are also removed.

There are three distinct versions of the Blueliner cars-

9101-9105 : These were ex Baggage Combines 302-306. The baggage compartment was replaced with more seating and big picture windows. They also had air conditioning, similar to the ones on the Silverliners. These would be the most difficult to make.

9106-9109: These were regular coaches 873-879, which were given air conditioning, and lost some windows. The airconditioners again were prominent

9110-9138: These would be the easiest, since relatively little would have to be done to represent these.

#9130 is representative of the average Blueliner. The only exterior differences are the new headlights, removal of the original roof vents, replaced by small corner vents, and the new paint job. The blueliners originally retained their rooftop bus connectors, though they are removed here.

[Image: 6623.1207738800.jpg]

#9107 was a coach equipped with an air condtioner. The main modeling challenge here would be to make the air conditioner vents and housings, and then blank out the windows above them.

[Image: tr_rdg9107.jpg]

#9104 was a former baggage combine, with the picture windows visible here. This would be the most challenging variant, since on top of the air conditioners, I'd have to modify the windows on the former baggage end. These windows are visible on the far end of the train. I couldn't find any good pictures showing the windows better!

[Image: pictures%5C21693%5C76-06_RDG_9104_W_Tren...142%5D.jpg]

[Image: pictures%5C21693%5C76-06_RDG_9104_W_Tren...142%5D.jpg]

The interior of a Blueliner was styled similarly to the Silverliner II, which was brand new in 1963 when these old MUs were built.

[Image: mlqnty.jpg]

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - jwb - 04-16-2014

Green_Elite_Cab Wrote:I also hesitated since these are VERY modern cars, and certainly do NOT match my late 70s modeling.

That said, I had really wanted these cars since I ride them almost every time I go to New York City, and I like them alot.

This has seldom bothered me, and I don't believe it bothered John Allen -- whose modeling still has a great deal of appeal, since graffen has posted a new plan inspired by the G&D. I think John Allen had two big insights. One is that, although the era of equipment may vary, its function remains very similar over decades and now even centuries. A switcher is a switcher. A flat car is a flat car. But also, there's a lot of slop in what we see: there are plenty of Railboxes out there with 40-year-old paint. The UP stirs things up by restoring a Big Boy. Allen saw a layout as a way to experience and celebrate all this.

Re: GEC's Layout Progress - Green_Elite_Cab - 04-16-2014

jwb Wrote:
Green_Elite_Cab Wrote:I also hesitated since these are VERY modern cars, and certainly do NOT match my late 70s modeling.

That said, I had really wanted these cars since I ride them almost every time I go to New York City, and I like them alot.

This has seldom bothered me, and I don't believe it bothered John Allen -- whose modeling still has a great deal of appeal, since graffen has posted a new plan inspired by the G&D. I think John Allen had two big insights. One is that, although the era of equipment may vary, its function remains very similar over decades and now even centuries. A switcher is a switcher. A flat car is a flat car. But also, there's a lot of slop in what we see: there are plenty of Railboxes out there with 40-year-old paint. The UP stirs things up by restoring a Big Boy. Allen saw a layout as a way to experience and celebrate all this.

Its funny you mentioned railbox cars, I just saw a bunch that were so faded out that you could barely make out that "X" logo!

In any case, this is more of a budgetary question than a time period nitpick. I have to prioritize what I really want to make the best of the money I can devote to the hobby.

If I had unlimited funds, I wouldn't think twice about picking up the trains I liked, regardless of what time period or prototype they were. Using the prototype time-range as criteria for making a purchase is a good way to screen out models that aren't necessary, and lets me devote money towards other applicable projects that most further my goals.

Also, if I was modeling the modern day, and used some old stuff, that would be OK. If I'm modeling the past, visitors from the future are out of place.