GP 15

[P5se Camelback]

... the Smoke Valley units are probably the most work and least accurate (though very easy to detail to the point of surpassing the Athearn). For a time, these were the only GP15s out there. ...

Back when those Smokey Valley kits first came out, and I was helping my then-six-year-old daughter detail, paint and decal a Conrail GP38-2, we had used up a 24-exposure roll of film photographing the unit for documentation from which to apply details and decals. I used up another roll on a Conrail GP15-1 found in that same small yard in Lansdale, PA. I bought the Smokey Valley multi-part body, handrail and chassis kits with the idea of having my own locomotive to run on the small layout we were building together for her.

Life happened, there was a job change, a move, etc. She grew up and her time became totally consumed with the repetitious practice of a pitcher in Fast-Pitch Softball. [She became good enough to qualify for the U.S. National Team as a 16 year old ... but that's another story.]

I still have all of the Smokey Valley stuff and with my newly awakened interest in diesels, I'm wondering exactly which parts of the kits are not accurate and need to be replaced to properly represent a Conrail GP15-1. Your expertise in that area would be a huge help prior to unpacking that stuff and preparing for the build.

[Sumpter250]

To my knowledge, there were only two versions of the GP15-1, and the C&NW "normally aspirated" version was one of them, so if your "body" doesn't have all the louvers behind the cab, it's probably the correct one for Conrail. I know that Athearn did a lot of research on the GP15, before going into production. Their GP15, if painted and lettered for Conrail is most likely very accurate, at least for the number, or number series they've produced.
I'm not 100% sure the C&NW had the only ones of that kind, but there were limited numbers of them.
Oh, I remember that the original issue of Smokey Valley kits were not the C&NW version.

[P5se Camelback]

I bought my kits #50 (GP15-1 body,) #55 (handrails & stanchions) and # 56 (GP15-1 cast frame) in 1991 and all are clearly marked "Conrail" on the package. I bought a Cannon thin-wall cab at the same time for the model along with a handful of additional detail parts. And I do remember all those louvers behind the cab ... I always thought the C&NW version "looked strange" without them!

I just wondered which parts G.E.C. was referring to as inaccurate!

[Green_Elite_Cab]

I bought my kits #50 (GP15-1 body,) #55 (handrails & stanchions) and # 56 (GP15-1 cast frame) in 1991 and all are clearly marked "Conrail" on the package. I bought a Cannon thin-wall cab at the same time for the model along with a handful of additional detail parts. And I do remember all those louvers behind the cab ... I always thought the C&NW version "looked strange" without them!

I just wondered which parts G.E.C. was referring to as inaccurate!

The issues with the Smokey Valley GP15-1 kits really are very VERY slight. All the body pieces are correct, the only areas that are noticeably wrong are the very ends (aka, the nose, and the very rear end of the hood). In fact, the Smokey Valley GP15-1s have the most scale pilots you can get outside of brass (they're prototype thickness).

The Smokey Valley Nose section is the correct 88" nose, but the nose is t0o "Pointy". At first, i thought i could get away with this, but when you park a smokey valley GP15-1 next to any other EMD switcher by athearn, Atlas, P1/2k, Its very easy to see the nose is WAY too pointy. the rear suffers the same problem.

Luckily, it is no problem at all the install a Cannon nose and cannon ends/roof sections. This has the added benefit of increasing the detail accuracy.

Another issues is that the Smokey Valley fuel tank is way to shallow, and it makes the model seem higher off the ground than it is. Fuel tank details that fit are readily available as spare parts from Athearn or Railflyer Models.

Jim Six did an article on Main-line modeler about adjusting the Smokey Valley GP15-1s to be more prototypical, even going so far as to modify the original smokey Vally frame by milling down truck mounting location to get the correct frame height, but i think that is a step to far. Bottom line, some elbow grease will get you what you want if you go the Smokey Valley route. At this point, though, it is probably MUCH easier to get the Athearn or P1k versions, so unless you can find the smokey valley parts easily, its probably better to go that way.

[Green_Elite_Cab]

To my knowledge, there were only two versions of the GP15-1, and the C&NW "normally aspirated" version was one of them, so if your "body" doesn't have all the louvers behind the cab, it's probably the correct one for Conrail. I know that Athearn did a lot of research on the GP15, before going into production. Their GP15, if painted and lettered for Conrail is most likely very accurate, at least for the number, or number series they've produced.
I'm not 100% sure the C&NW had the only ones of that kind, but there were limited numbers of them.
Oh, I remember that the original issue of Smokey Valley kits were not the C&NW version.

there are 5 versions of the GP15 (though technically only two of those versions are GP15-1s).

Version 1- CN&W; Frisco-> Burlington Northern- GP15-1

12 cylinder without inertial Air intake (hence all the extra vents), and DC main generator, no Dynamic Brakes

Version 2 Conrail; Missouri Pacific- GP15-1

12 cylinders, Inertial air intakes, DC generators, no dynamic brakes

Version 3 Missouri Pacific GP15AC

12 Cylinders inertial air intakes, AR10 Alternator, no Dynamic brakes

Version 4 Apalachicola Northern- GP15T

8 cylinders turbocharged without inertial air intake, AR10 alternator and no dynamic brakes

Version 5 Chessie System-> CSX

8 cylinders turbocharged, inertial air intakes, AR10 alternator, WITH dynamic Brakes.


Now, i'm not 100% clear on what the external differences are between the MoPac GP15ACs and their GP15-1s (and by extension, the Conrail Version), but it seems like the basic body style is the same from the photos i've compared.

[P5se Camelback]

... The issues with the Smokey Valley GP15-1 kits really are very VERY slight. All the body pieces are correct, the only areas that are noticeably wrong are the very ends (i.e., the nose, and the very rear end of the hood.) ... The Smokey Valley nose section is the correct 88" nose, but the nose is too "pointy" ... it is no problem at all to install a Cannon nose and Cannon ends/roof sections. This has the added benefit of increasing the detail accuracy.

I'm sure I can get the Cannon nose and end/roof parts. And I've never shied away from a difficult project ... that was never an option in the design office!! 8-)

Another issue is that the Smokey Valley fuel tank is way too shallow, and it makes the model seem higher off the ground than it should be. Fuel tank details that fit are readily available as spare parts from Athearn or Railflyer Models.

If I can devise no other way, I'm certain that I could perform a little surgery on the Smokey Valley piece.

Jim Six did an article on Main-line modeler about adjusting the Smokey Valley GP15-1s to be more prototypical, even going so far as to modify the original Smokey Valley frame by milling down truck mounting location to get the correct frame height ... some elbow grease will get you what you want if you go the Smokey Valley route. ... so unless you can find the Smokey Valley parts easily ...

I'm pretty sure I have that Jim Six article, in Mainline Modeler, if I'm not mistaken. I've always admired his work.

Thanks for your input, G.E.C.! I'm sure it will be helpful down the line ... I'm being drawn to that Conrail GP15-1 ... with a can motor and a Tsunami decoder ... it should be an interesting, but fun build!

[Green_Elite_Cab]

I'm sure I can get the Cannon nose and end/roof parts. And I've never shied away from a difficult project ... that was never an option in the design office!! 8-)

Yeah, that's not a hard thing to change. The only pain is that the roof section is attached to the radiator on the end, and though its not hard to cut off, it was a little tricky to get the end to line up. I think i ended up cutting the cannon roof segment to approximately what it should be, and then sanded it down to be flush with the end of the Cannon rear hood piece, and then attached it to the back of the Smokey Valley shell.

If I can devise no other way, I'm certain that I could perform a little surgery on the Smokey Valley piece.

I've seen people add spacers to inside of the fuel tank casting, and then "smudge" the location of the air reservoir tanks to help meld it in, but i honestly think it might be easier to get the actual spare parts from athearn. In fact, Atlas may have it for as little as pocket change, and i may even have a tank that matches, now that i think of it.

I'm pretty sure I have that Jim Six article, in Mainline Modeler, if I'm not mistaken. I've always admired his work.

Thanks for your input, G.E.C.! I'm sure it will be helpful down the line ... I'm being drawn to that Conrail GP15-1 ... with a can motor and a Tsunami decoder ... it should be an interesting, but fun build!

That is absolutely right, he had two articles on the GP15-1 (building the Conrail version), and a third later on looking back on that project and going over ways to dramatically improve the model.

as far as sound decoders go, let me know how it works. My Athearn Genesis unit came with sound, and it is SO quiet. the speaker fires into a weight that is wedged up in the radiator just above the tunnel motor grills on the side. I know that some people don't like noses to be loud, that they like "scale volume", but there are volume controls for that. This thing is on MAX and i can whisper over it across the room to you.

[P5se Camelback]

G.E.C. ...

The GP15-1 project is down the list a few lines, but sliding on up as I become more fascinated with the diesels that I used to hate and totally igmore. I know have a lot of "catch-up learning" to do as a result. Building and detailing them seems to be the quickest route to understanding them.

When I do get around to it, whenever that happens to be, rest assured I will document the build, successes and pitfalls, right here for all to see.

"I ain't no how a-skeered!"

[train_guy]

Reinhard;

I purchased my rather expensive Athearn GP15-1 (MP version) based on the glowing review in MR. When I received it and put it on my test/breakin loop, it wouldn't run in DC mode other than it just begin to move at a full 12v then would stall and the sound system would reset. It would barely move another inch or so and stall again. Never made one complete loop of the test track. Next I tried operating it on DCC. It seemed to run okay on DCC for the most part, although not as good as any of my other DCC locos; but still had that constant stalling and sound system reset. Run a few inches, then stall and restart, repeatedly. I hooked up the DCC throttle to my test loop and got it running at a nice medium speed to break it in some, but after running it for 30 minutes in each direction. No change.

I removed the body shell (as much as you can) looking for any possible loose wires or other items that might have come loose during shipping and could find nothing. Track and wheels both clean, no obvious loose wiring and none of my other engines ever stall. Even the Athearn CF-7 that I put a simple decoder in, runs far better than the GP15.

I contacted Athearn and of course they want me to send it to them at my expense for "repairs". Since it was a gift, the sales receipt was lost/misplaced, so it doesn't qualify for warranty repairs and I've had it for more than 90 days. I have not sent it back to Athearn so far and at this point, I'm just writing it off as an expensive goof up!

I have seen videos on YouTube of other GP15-1's that folks have purchased and they seem to have no problems with theirs so I'm just guessing that it was my turn to get a lemon. I'm debating on sending it to Athearn, but right now I'd rather not put more money in this engine.

I too purchased a Athearn Genesis GP15-1 Undecorated with sound version,and had the same problems,and had sound issues as well,the speaker was installed upside down(can you believe it?) So i sent it back to M.B.Klein for my money back.I still plan on purchasing the CSX version when it is released,although i have been considering a UP version,cause i have been considering modeling the L.A.area as opposed to the Detroit area.
Rail pictures archives has a listing of UP GP15-1's and it does specify which UP numbered loco was a MP,or CNW version.Their were also UP GP15-1's lettered UPY,what ever that means?I too really like this loco and have been awaiting it's arrival,but according to Athearns website,they have been delayed till late may of 2011. :cry:

[train_guy]

I was curious about the new Athern Genesis GP15. My hope to get an MP based UP GP15 to be used in the LA area vanished after I learned the UP GP15 will be based on the CNW model.

I tried another approach and got a Conrail GP15 and put the shell of an P1K UP GP15 on it. The low end P1K shell got some details and the Conrail drive a gray UP paint job. The result looks ok but not great to me but it runs very smooth and silent. That is a good deal for my poor eye sight but excellent ears.Those of you with good eyes would call it possibly a down grade :o





Some remarks about the conversion:
The P1K shell has four extra screws to mount it to the drive. This four parts in the corners of the shell must be removed up to the roof of the long and short hood. About 2,5 mm styrene must be glued inside under the couplers. They will hold the shell by the coupler screws as usual.
Two very bright LED can be attached to the PCB directly where the bulbs have been connected. 1.5 Volt is not a lot for LED but if you use very bright LED it will be ok. That prevents any modifications to the Athearn drive and shell. The more expensive Athearn Genesis GP15 will be left untouched. The trucks and tank have been painted with custom mixed TAMYA flat paint. That paint is not very stable and can be washed off if required later.

My Athearn drive did not show any problems reported here. The current pickup is very stable and it runs smooth and silent after about 30 minutes break in.

ps. I got a Conrail because the shell is a good base for a possible layout in the east. The shell can be easy patched to NS spanning a large time frame.

Actually,it looks really good!

[Green_Elite_Cab]

Next I tried operating it on DCC. It seemed to run okay on DCC for the most part, although not as good as any of my other DCC locos; but still had that constant stalling and sound system reset. Run a few inches, then stall and restart, repeatedly. I hooked up the DCC throttle to my test loop and got it running at a nice medium speed to break it in some, but after running it for 30 minutes in each direction. No change.

its interesting that this thread pops up again, im trying to make a video of my layout using that GP15-1 and its doing all of those things now, which is annoying, it never did this at my train club's layout. i'm gonna bring it back there on thursday to see if its just my layout (which definitely isn't perfect track work wise).

its goes, it stalls, and starts again. I cleaned my track and polished the wheels, but now it just looses the sound, but sorta keeps going. I did notice there were some tracks in particular where it responded poorly, but other engines, both sound equipped and not, went right through (namely an Atlas GP40-2 and p2k SD9) no problems.

its just a little frustrating, it has never done that to me before.

I have seen videos on YouTube of other GP15-1's that folks have purchased and they seem to have no problems with theirs so I'm just guessing that it was my turn to get a lemon. I'm debating on sending it to Athearn, but right now I'd rather not put more money in this engine.

I've noticed this about alot of the Athearn models lately, which is why i have shied away from them. my last Athearn locomotive was a used RS2, but its been giving all sorts of problems as well. I have that thing totally taken apart because i suspect that the wires and the wheels are messed up. there was at least one instance where one wheelset was pressed in to close and was touching the other "half", shorting the model (this also happened to one of my Atlas engines).

[Green_Elite_Cab]

I too purchased a Athearn Genesis GP15-1 Undecorated with sound version,and had the same problems,and had sound issues as well,the speaker was installed upside down(can you believe it?) So i sent it back to M.B.Klein for my money back.I still plan on purchasing the CSX version when it is released,although i have been considering a UP version,cause i have been considering modeling the L.A.area as opposed to the Detroit area.
Rail pictures archives has a listing of UP GP15-1's and it does specify which UP numbered loco was a MP,or CNW version.Their were also UP GP15-1's lettered UPY,what ever that means?I too really like this loco and have been awaiting it's arrival,but according to Athearns website,they have been delayed till late may of 2011. :cry:

actually, you can't install it upside down, i've tried. The sound on these GP15s is VERY quiet. I thought flipping it around would help, but it doesn't. it doesn't seem to fit right.

UPY means its a Yard locomotive, or something of that nature.