Question re 3-1/2" & 4 3/4" gauge garden locos?

[RobertInOntario]

My son & I enjoy visiting various live-steam, miniature railways. Some of these -- the smaller ones -- run on 3-1/2" & 4-3/4" gauge track.

I've learned that a live steam model steam loco usually costs around $3,500 -- well outside of my budget! However, I was wondering if it's possible to buy electric powered models in this gauge or scale and, if so, where could one buy them?

You'd think that there would be electric-powered models -- of diesel, electric or even steam prototypes! -- in this scale that could haul passengers as the live-steam ones do.

Please note that -- at this point -- this is only a dream or half-baked idea! I just thought it would be cool to have one of these locos.

Thanks for any feedback or advice!

Rob

[Sumpter250]

Robert,
1/2" gauge track: The scale would be 1:113, if it is "standard gauge", 1:72, if it is 3' narrow gauge.

4-3/4" gauge track: The scale would be 1:11.9 if it is "standard gauge", 1:7.58, if it is 3' narrow gauge.

I think 1:113, is close to TT scale( 1:120 ? correct me if I'm wrong ) ----- 1/11.9, about twice the size of G scale. There might, be something in those scales, with electric motors, but none that I've ever heard of ( except that TT scale is still "somewhat available", "somewhere" ).

[MasonJar]

Lynn Johnston's (cartoon For Better or For Worse) husband Rod runs something called Riding Railkits, which seems to be out of business, but still has some links you might find useful.

The local Ottawa group is Ottawa Valley Live Steamers who operate at the Cumberland Museum. They aren't restricted to steam however - I have seen "rideable" diesel models that sound as if they have a lawnmower engine or other small gas engine in them. I can't get to their website right now, but there may be some info there.

Not thinking they are much cheaper... at least not from what I can recall of the Riding Railkits prices.


Andrew

[RobertInOntario]

Robert,
1/2" gauge track: The scale would be 1:113, if it is "standard gauge", 1:72, if it is 3' narrow gauge.

4-3/4" gauge track: The scale would be 1:11.9 if it is "standard gauge", 1:7.58, if it is 3' narrow gauge.

I think 1:113, is close to TT scale( 1:120 ? correct me if I'm wrong ) ----- 1/11.9, about twice the size of G scale. There might, be something in those scales, with electric motors, but none that I've ever heard of ( except that TT scale is still "somewhat available", "somewhere" ).

So sorry -- that was a typo on my part! It should have read 3-1/2" & 4-3/4" gauge track!! Apologies for this confusion but thanks for your feedback!

[RobertInOntario]

Lynn Johnston's (cartoon For Better or For Worse) husband Rod runs something called Riding Railkits, which seems to be out of business, but still has some links you might find useful.

The local Ottawa group is Ottawa Valley Live Steamers who operate at the Cumberland Museum. They aren't restricted to steam however - I have seen "rideable" diesel models that sound as if they have a lawnmower engine or other small gas engine in them. I can't get to their website right now, but there may be some info there.

Not thinking they are much cheaper... at least not from what I can recall of the Riding Railkits prices.


Andrew

Thanks, Andrew. I'll keep looking & thinking but won't get my hopes up. You're probably right -- the costs for even electric or gas-powered are probably very high. Please note my correction above -- I'm referring to 3-1/2" & 4-3/4" gauge (not 1/2" gauge!).

At any rate, it's still fun to visit these miniature railway sites & help out & join in on the comradery.

Cheers, Rob

[rrinker]

That's one of my lottery winner dreams - enough land to run something like that, and the money to buy the required tools to build a kit live steamer or three to run around on my propertly. Totally scratchbuilt - I would say is beyond my talent range. I've also seen some nice diesels on display, that use a gas engine and hydraulic drive. Even a second oen to MU - it ahs hydraulic lines as MU hoses so the trailer has 'traction motors' but there's only one gas prime mover for both. Or I could jsut join the local club, they have both common smaller sizes plus an 15" gauge line - amuesement park trains, only their equipment is mostly done up realistically, except for some of the rider cars.

--Randy

[RobertInOntario]

That's one of my lottery winner dreams - enough land to run something like that, and the money to buy the required tools to build a kit live steamer or three to run around on my propertly. Totally scratchbuilt - I would say is beyond my talent range. I've also seen some nice diesels on display, that use a gas engine and hydraulic drive. Even a second oen to MU - it ahs hydraulic lines as MU hoses so the trailer has 'traction motors' but there's only one gas prime mover for both. Or I could jsut join the local club, they have both common smaller sizes plus an 15" gauge line - amuesement park trains, only their equipment is mostly done up realistically, except for some of the rider cars.

--Randy

Thanks Randy,

I'm hoping that it's possible to get a battery-powered model in these smaller gauges. I know they do have battery-powered diesels in the larger scale. I've seen one at our nearest live steam club. So one would think it wouldn't be that difficult for a company to manufacture one in these smaller 3.5 to 4.75" gauges. I bet I'm still dreaming though & that the cost would be high!

Cheers, Rob

[rrinker]

I guess after the hassle of charging a car battery (you'd need something that big for those scales because you ride on them, not run alongside), it would be easier to just use a small gas engine. One of the members of the locla club as a small diesel switcher he brings to the open houses, it has about a 5hp horizontal shaft gas engine in it. The big 15" gauge diesel has, or had, a Ford Model A motor in it. The steamers are actual live steamers, naturally.

--Randy

[MasonJar]

According to Pete's calculations above, you are looking at 1:8 or 1:12 scale - at this size, pretty much anything will be expensive.

You might want to check G scale stuff if you want to be out-of-doors... Our local G scale groups are <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.ovgrs.com">http://www.ovgrs.com</a><!-- m --> (Ottaw Valley Garden Railway Society) and Smith Fall's G-men (search for their Facebook group/page with "GMEN trains"). Ironically, they are a modular, indoor garden railway group...


Andrew

[RobertInOntario]

According to Pete's calculations above, you are looking at 1:8 or 1:12 scale - at this size, pretty much anything will be expensive.

You might want to check G scale stuff if you want to be out-of-doors... Our local G scale groups are <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.ovgrs.com">http://www.ovgrs.com</a><!-- m --> (Ottaw Valley Garden Railway Society) and Smith Fall's G-men (search for their Facebook group/page with "GMEN trains"). Ironically, they are a modular, indoor garden railway group...


Andrew

Thanks, Andrew! Still looking/investigating. R.

[morten1996]

Hello Rob,

If you're on a limited budget ,but wanting more than a simple 4 wheeled box on wheels; I'd suggest to build a unit by yourself...the only really important ability you have to have is patience - it takes a year or two.
Building a prototypical electric loco in 1"-scale yourself isn't neither very expensive nor too complicated. For the frame it requires some welding (maybe you have a friend with equipment or ask a local car shop). For the drive-line, wheel-sets are available at reasonable costs - some even with the appropriate bearings (or you could fit some industrial bearings 'cages' onto the axles. All other parts of the drive-line are available from industrial supply. Motors for trucks are usually scooters motor around $50. Most expensive thing is the electrical controlling - I've good experiences with 4QD from UK.

The complexity of the shell of the loco is given by it's shape - if you prefer modern hood diesels, you mostly have joint flat, even panels (e.g. my F40PH). If you prefer only cab-units one possibility is to shape the core of the shell with Styrofoam or something similar and put glass-fiber&resin onto it. After hardening the foam core can be removed.
Asking guys building RC-planes of ships would be helpful when working with resin & glass-fibers for the first time.

IMHO the only complicated thing is the (prototypical looking) construction of the truck's side-frames; however, on my units I always use inside bearings so my side-frames are 'dummies' which eases the construction.
Also there are molded side-frames (Blomberg B) available (I ordered them as spare-parts from British MAXITRAK).

You may have a look on my project's blog http://large-scaledieselmodels.blogspot.de/- the newer projects are documented almost 'step-by-step' ('Aerotrain', Krauss-Maffei, M-10005).

Regards
Norman

[RobertInOntario]

Thanks, Norman. I'll give this some though, although this is definitely a down-the-road project. I'm enjoying helping out at our local club though.