Officially unemployed

[P5se Camelback]

... There is going to be a huge knowledge and information gap. Earlier this week, I literally had to explain to someone (who still remains) how to save their excel file. Those people are the ones that remain.

Kevin,
For what it's worth, I know just how you feel, sorta. Except, in the corporate world, it works the opposite way!

After 38 years as an Industrial Design professional, working my way up from "Designer" to "Staff Designer," "Senior Designer," "Head Program Designer" and finally "Design Manager" of a locaal plant in a major corporation (300,000 employees, world-wide) I found this "little" job, here in Florida, designing furniture for a "Ready-to-Assemble" funiture manufacturer. Never having designed any furniture and not knowing their manufacturing processes at all I had a ton of homework to do to get up to speed as fast as I could! But after two years I had won them their first National Design Award.

Jump forward three more years. There were four of us designers, a VP of Design and an admin assistant in this little design office in Ft. Myrs, Florida. Between the four of us there was close to 150 years of experience. The whole rest of the corporation was (is) in Jamestown, NY. One day we heard that they had hired three new designers, fresh out of school. A week later, these three pups came down to pay us a visit. I was doing a marker rendering on my drawing board (I was gettinig to the point of giving a photo a run for the money.) This "kid" of 22 or 23 asked, "How did you do that?" I looked at him. :?: "With all these markers, some pastels, a little white gouche on a 4/0 brush, why?" He couldn't draw, only use CAD. He had no practical design experience ... and the furniture business is cutthroat! hock:

Long story short ... within a month they closed our office and laid us all off! Save that annual rent, save by not having to pay all those big salaries. As a result of going with "No Experience" they have lost over 60% of marketshare and are in danger of going Chapter 7 ... Bankrupt!

Lay off the guys with the larger salaries (and the most knowledge and experience) and keep the guys with the lower salaries, "They only draw pictures, what do we need them for anyway?"

And so it goes.

Good luck finding suitable employment, Kevin. I feel for you!

[Sumpter250]

He could only use CAD. He had no practical design experience ... and the furniture business is cutthroat! hock:
Long story short ... within a month they closed our office and laid us all off! Save that annual rent, save by not having to pay all those big salaries. As a result of going with "No Experience" they have lost over 60% of marketshare and are in danger of going Chapter 7 ... Bankrupt!
Lay off the guys with the larger salaries (and the most knowledge and experience) and keep the guys with the lower salaries, "They only draw pictures, what do we need them for anyway?"

C.A.D. - Computer Aided Design......well no, not really, it really stands for Can't Actually, Draw !!! :o
( I have to admit CAD is a useful tool, but to use it properly , one still has to be able to draw. CAD is no more than an "ever sharp" pencil, creativity resides in the mind, not in the computer )

Why is it, that the species Homo Stupidicus always seems to rise to the top of any corporate structure??
Perhaps it confirms the old adage, stuff floats!

[doctorwayne]

Why is it, that the species Homo Stupidicus always seems to rise to the top of any corporate structure??
Perhaps it confirms the old adage, stuff floats!

It's the "Peter Principal" at work (sorry Pete, nothin' personal).

A person will rise to the level of his incompetence.

That is to say, you will be, for the most part, promoted because of your skills and abilities. However, you will eventually reach a position which is beyond the scope of your expertise - your "level of incompetence". For some, the journey is short indeed.

Wayne

[P5se Camelback]

C.A.D. - Computer Aided Design......well no, not really, it really stands for Can't Actually, Draw !!! :o
( I have to admit CAD is a useful tool, but to use it properly , one still has to be able to draw. CAD is no more than an "ever sharp" pencil, creativity resides in the mind, not in the computer )
Why is it, that the species Homo Stupidicus always seems to rise to the top of any corporate structure??
Perhaps it confirms the old adage, stuff floats!

You've got all of that exactly right! Any attempt to conceptualize on CAD can be "out-shined" as far as creative thinking goes with a felt tip on a pad of paper! CAD is great AFTER you've got a decent concept nailed down that needs the kind of tweeking that constantly having to draw the whole thing just to change the relationship of two details to each other is stifling! And it does a nice job on engineering drawngs, too.

But the actual thinking part still happens in you head, travels down your arm, through your hand, into the marker and out onto a piece of paper ... I got to where I just sat and watched it happen! :o

Those poor kids were unknowingly thrown into the deep end and told to swim! hock: They were instantly in so far over their heads ... it was really sad, but then,they were upper, upper management's choice.


THAT was the Peter Principle in practice -- the guy who had just been promoted to Sr. V.P. had no business being there, he wanted to wield power and replacing all of us with a trio of "Yes" men was the best he could do!

[RobertInOntario]

Boy, it seems like so many states/provinces/cities are either broke or going broke.
My employer is also struggling financially & we had some salary cut backs last year in lieu of extra vacation time.

I do wish you all the best in your new search. Hopefully, you can get a little extra rest as well as some modeling time.

Rob

[RobertInOntario]

I never thought I'd be posting something like this, but I might just be about to join your ranks, at least partially! Long story short, my employer is asking several staff to temporarily work a 3-day work week (i.e. a temporary, partial layoff).

The details are still being worked out.... But I could end up having much more time to model and visit heritage trains, but not much money to do things!

[nachoman]

I never thought I'd be posting something like this, but I might just be about to join your ranks, at least partially! Long story short, my employer is asking several staff to temporarily work a 3-day work week (i.e. a temporary, partial layoff).

The details are still being worked out.... But I could end up having much more time to model and visit heritage trains, but not much money to do things!

Just don't let yourself get too down about it. Use the extra time to get caught up, and spend more time with your kids.

[P5se Camelback]

IMHO, if we want this situation to change, we need to return the economy to the private sector! Taxing the "rich" to raise more money, to hire more government workers so that the Government can say they are "creating" jobs is in reality just so much eye candy for the ill-informed to nibble on, to make them feel like soon, maybe they to will "find" a job.

"Redistributing the wealth," taking from those who have to give to those who don't have, disincentivizes those who do make money from working to make more money (why, if it's only going to be taken away?) and reinforces the "comfortable" slothfulness of those who don't work (why work - the Fed will give me money.) When was the last time you were hired for a good job with a good income stream from a poor man?!! That doesn't happen.

Rather than drag the people with money down to the level of those who don't, let's resurrect the American Dream and give incentive to those who have little or no money to work, earn, save and invest, and by doing so, become one of the people who have money! It's called Capitalism, and it works every time it's tried. What doesn't work (except for the very few in the "Ruling Class" - which is closed to entry by others) are Socialism and Communism! Those systems only succeed in keeping the little man down, so he won't threaten the Ruling Class, who need "workers" to produce things for them to use, because none of them ever produce anything other than rules and regulations to "keep their boot on the neck" of the workers!

Argue if you wish, but THINK about what you have just read!

I wish the best of providence to all those who are out of work, desire to work and are actively pursuing a position that will bring them satisfaction and prosperity!

[sgtcarl1]

AMEN, brother, AMEN!!!! I agree with you whole-heartedly!!! We should just tar and feather those who are taking away our rights, and run them out of town on a rail!! (wouldn't be too difficult to find the tar, just go to Louisiana!)

[RobertInOntario]

I never thought I'd be posting something like this, but I might just be about to join your ranks, at least partially! Long story short, my employer is asking several staff to temporarily work a 3-day work week (i.e. a temporary, partial layoff).
The details are still being worked out.... But I could end up having much more time to model and visit heritage trains, but not much money to do things!

Just don't let yourself get too down about it. Use the extra time to get caught up, and spend more time with your kids.

Thanks for your encouragement, Kevin. I do plan to do things like this, especially since it's supposed to be a temporary & partial layoff. I'm actually looking forward to having two days per week to do other things. Having so many interests -- trains, of course, being one the the main ones -- I have all sorts of ways to use my extra time. I might even volunteer to help at one of our heritage railways.

However, I will still need to fire up my resumé and do some job searching.

How is your situation going?

Cheers, Rob

[nachoman]

How is your situation going?

Cheers, Rob

I'm doing my best to avoid relocating. I would rather work out of my field than have to pack up and move. Nonetheless, I learned the other day that the mine in which I base my layout on is hiring. Unfortunately, the mine is about 3 hours from here. I am gong to apply anyway (can't hurt). You never know what kind of shifts or arrangements they may have for commuters. Plus, I look at any interview as a learning experience. But, it is also a good indicator of the overall economy. Most copper mining in arizona closed up in the 1980s as it became cheaper to mine overseas. A few mines were kept open subsidized by the federal government. When the price of copper shot up about 7 years ago, many mines expanded operations and talked of re-opening dormant mines. But when the economy went bad 2-3 years ago, the price of copper dropped again and the mines slowed and many were laid off. The fact that the mines are hiring again is a good indicator. Not only is the mine business increasing, but the contractors (consultants) they hire to do water and environmental studies will have work again.

[tomustang]

Long story short ... within a month they closed our office and laid us all off! Save that annual rent, save by not having to pay all those big salaries. As a result of going with "No Experience" they have lost over 60% of marketshare and are in danger of going Chapter 7 ... Bankrupt!

Lay off the guys with the larger salaries (and the most knowledge and experience) and keep the guys with the lower salaries, "They only draw pictures, what do we need them for anyway?"

Our corporate sector's biggest mistake and still haven't learned from it, today's college education doesn't mean squat, heck just to get a bachelors 70% of your classes won't even deal with your major, so why add up the debt. Green grads and companies that hire them thinking they'll save on experienced workers salaries either fails fast or is one rats nest of problems.

This "kid" of 22 or 23 asked, "How did you do that?" I looked at him. :?: "With all these markers, some pastels, a little white gouche on a 4/0 brush, why?" He couldn't draw, only use CAD

Getting to that, my wife did a contract job for an engineering firm, one of the older guys (60's~) never used CAD, refused it and only drew out everything, no one questioned him since he was the 'top dog', no one was better than him. They use to scan in his drawings and work from there. Unfortunately not many others in the dept worked that hard, cut corners, made HUGE mistakes with strengthen and structural integrity, while instead of admitting the problems they stuck with the deadline. Well after that my wife quit since it's not morale to be part of a team that would risk buildings that would crumble in on millwrights trying to work in them, since this is similar to jobs I've done before.

[RobertInOntario]

How is your situation going?

Cheers, Rob

I'm doing my best to avoid relocating. I would rather work out of my field than have to pack up and move. Nonetheless, I learned the other day that the mine in which I base my layout on is hiring. Unfortunately, the mine is about 3 hours from here. I am gong to apply anyway (can't hurt). You never know what kind of shifts or arrangements they may have for commuters. Plus, I look at any interview as a learning experience. But, it is also a good indicator of the overall economy. Most copper mining in arizona closed up in the 1980s as it became cheaper to mine overseas. A few mines were kept open subsidized by the federal government. When the price of copper shot up about 7 years ago, many mines expanded operations and talked of re-opening dormant mines. But when the economy went bad 2-3 years ago, the price of copper dropped again and the mines slowed and many were laid off. The fact that the mines are hiring again is a good indicator. Not only is the mine business increasing, but the contractors (consultants) they hire to do water and environmental studies will have work again.

Thanks. You raise a good point -- that it can still be wise to apply for a job even when you're uncertain about the job for various reasons.

A job recently came up for which I'm only partly qualified. It was for an organization that I really like and support, but required some speaking and fund-raising skills. But I'd only have some of the skills needed for this job as I have no fund-raising skills at all. So I didn't apply -- but maybe I should have? because I wouldn't have anything to lose & it would be a learning experience (updating my resume and getting used to interviews again, etc.).

Are you doing OK financially and are you enjoying the extra time?

Rob

[nachoman]

An update here -

I have done my best to remain persistent despite a growing desire to give up. After six months of false hope and bad news, 100 resumes and applications, it is tempting to say "what's the point" when I hear of another job posting. But, this week things are looking a tad brighter. I've managed to schedule an interview for early next week (first one since January), and my slow nagging of a temp-to-hire agency may also be getting me somewhere. I don't want to "count my chickens", but right now I have two decent prospects and that are better than I have had since being laid off. At the very least, it gives me renewed motivation. Keep your fingers crossed for me.

[MasonJar]

Keep your fingers crossed for me.

Absolutely!! And a couple of these too to your renewed motivation.

Andrew