Pacific South Eastern Railway

[Wiredup]

After my abysmal attempt at track laying and having increasing issues with warped track, it was time to revamp and make something not only more functional, but more interesting.

Currently I can only run one train at a time, safely, I plan to fix this.

I wanna have to layers running at once, and I think I figured out how to do it!


The above is my current progression on my revision.

The helices are 8.5" tall with a grade of 1.6% and 14" radius! The minimum radius outside of the yard is also 14" so far. The actual yard has a minimal radius of 12". Which is a huge improvement compared to the 11" curves in the original track plan.

The helices will take the train down from the mountain to the lower level where the industries will be located, and hopefuly return loops on each end so that a train can operate on the lower level.... I think I'll build the upper level and then build the lower section once I have to the top completed.


now who has good plans on building a helix? Cus I have no idea how!

[TrainNut]

Wow! Luke, I must apologize as I've not checked in on this thread in quite a while. Lots of things to comment on so let's get started...

My last layout had a bunch of 4% grades on it. Everybody told me to keep 'em not so steep but I didn't listen as I wanted maximum relief in the space that I had. Not too long after I had my mainline completed, I chopped the layout in half, added another three feet in the middle so that I could reduce all grades to 2%. I should'a listened!

I use most of the same procedures for gluing track as you do BUT, I don't glue my track down. I start with foam, glue cork to that or my WS grades and riser (Elmers is sufficient) and then I nail the track down with the little N scale nails and that seems to be sufficient. My trains will run continuously with no problems usually (unless I have people over and I look away!) Because all I am pushing the nails into is through the ties, into the cork, and foam under that, a nail set is sufficient with light pressure. Be careful not to push the nails in too far as that will warp the ties and bring your rails closer together causing derailments. I just tore that layout up her not too long ago and I was able to salvage all of the flex track that I had not ballasted (which was most of it.) I plan to use it all on the next layout. Make sure you solder your joints for better electrical contact.

Since you seem to be revamping the plan, these comments will be moot however, for learning sake, I noticed in your video, that you had an S curve. Sometimes they can't be avoided but try at all costs as with long passenger cars like the ones you've got, it will be a constant problem area. Shortly after that, just before you entered the tunnel down on the left side, your daylight stalled. It looks to me like you've got a pretty tight radius there and I suspect that's your problem. It looked like there may have been another up towards the back on the right side of the layout. If I recall correctly, the Challenger requires a minimum 12" radius and you mentioned having 11". Again, a cause for the locomotive to stall. I accidently ran my Big Boy around a smaller radius (switch was thrown the wrong way and I wasn't paying attention) and it broke the driveline. Watch out!

Another thing to watch out for if you want smooth running trains is to really concentrate on having smooth grade transitions. I noticed in your videos that those could use some work. It was also evident that they were the cause of uncoupling problems. It doesn't take much to make these little couplers come undone and experience has taught me to keep my transitions smooooooooth!

That building you've got.... yes, paint the inside with SEVERAL coats of flat black and it will really help it from "glowing." Another idea is to put a resistor in line to cut down the brightness.

Lastly, in regards to your tunnel through the foam, I've used that method in the past (the mountain with a lift off top). May I suggest another method for you to look into. Make a newspaper mountain and then cover it with Plaster cloth. When the plaster cloth dries, remove the newspaper for a nice shell that you can reach inside of. It also saves on foam.

Well, I could elaborate for pages but I'll save you that agony. If you'd like pictoral examples of anything, let me know and I'll see what I can dig up.

[Wiredup]

Thanks for all the great advice!

I've cut grades down twice, and it will be a third time with this new revision. I went from 5% to 4% to 2% and now 1.6%

For some reason I always want these huge transitions because they seem to look better...but now that I've had more experience I know that they dont, and it just makes for bigger issues.

I think I'll try your method with laying flex, and I'm going to use Cork as WS trackbed is getting much too expensive for a third revamp.

All the previous curves were 11" radius, but I've changed that and now I'm running 13" minimum. My passenger cars should operate a whole not nicer now!!!


Once I get back from Florida I'll start putting hammer to nails again and getting back in the game. But for now, it'll all be replanning and solidifying.

[Wiredup]

Some major revisions of the track plan. I'm tearing everything up and starting anew...

I've been able to salvage 90% of my switches, the ones I couldn't salvage are crappy lil $10 Atlas switches that were causing major issues anyways, so I'm not bothered... all the Peco stuff was saved though.

So this layout SHOULD be less complicated, and much easier to build. I should also still get my 'mountain town' feel from it. I gave up the huge scenic runs to allow for more operation potential. But I still need to make some adjustments because I would really like to run two trains at the same time safely, and still be playing switcher in one of the yards/branch.

There is a total of 5 inches of elevation from the lowest to the highest track line in this layout, but I set standards before I started design and only broke one... my standard was a max grade of 2%. The max grade on the main is 2.6% which means I'm going to have some fun with those stupid woodland scenic risers.... so a 1.5% grade and 1% grade kit stacked should work.... The average grade is 1.6%

The standard for minimum curve was 12" radius... I ended up with 13" radius minimums! The average being closer to 15". this makes me very happy as before it was 11" radius curves and it was getting sketchy with my locos and passenger cars.

I'll be adding sidings to certain areas during construction depending on how the scenic goes... but I still wanna make a few edits...

Currently the is no way to run 2 trains at the same time without the fear of them killing each other... That and there is no real branch line either.... I got a 10x10 foot room! This should be easier.....

heres the plan:

upper level


lower level



I'm still not happy....



if anyone has any tips for me... here are the standards/concept I'm looking for:

- Minimum 12" curves for passenger cars. prefer 13" +
- Steam servicing tracks (4 for coaling tower, plus room for roundhouse and 130' table)
- double tracked passenger terminal separate from freight yard.
- passenger terminal needs a minimum of 5 feet of track (my longest train)
- freight yard
- lumber industry
- mining industry
- pulp mill (in terminal area?)
- freight terminal
- smaller branch line with freight/passenger terminal
- elevation changes
- max 2.5% grade
- water
- trains criss-crossin over each other w/bridges
- junctions

[Wiredup]

I think I got it!



this is my latest design. I've got most of my operational guidlines in place...
- 2 trains at a time with minimal focus needed. (so I can theoretically run both trains and do switching at the yard without risking a crash)
- steam servicing terminal...with room to expand
- double tracked passenger terminal
- freight yard (same as original, just 10" shorter, but with a few more spurs)
- LOTS of room for industry
- elevation changes with bridges of trains crossing each other
- max 2.0 grade
- junctions
- room for lots of different scenicing opportunities including water

Currently this plan only has the mainline and terminal mapped out. I plan on transferring the main line onto the benchwork and then start layingout the industry and scenery once I have my grades/trackbed laid in.

I just need a good resource for how to lay reliable n-scale track. I'm using Atlas code 80 for all tracks, and peco turnouts.

[TrainNut]

That looks pretty good! I'm not sure what goes over and what goes under but for the sake of perspective, try and keep your low lines out front and your high lines towards the back... again, sometimes this just can't be helped. Where your loop crosses over itself down about the middle of the plan over on the right hand side, you've set yourself up for another S curve. If you don't bring that top curve around quite so far, you can straighten that out a bit giving you some straight in between your approach to the next curve. It will also help you to cross the line below/above at more of a right angle helping to shorten your bridge span. Clear as mud?
I'm sure you've also already thought of this and so I will just echo it back but your reach into those two top back corners is going to be atrocious... especially the right one. If your a skinny person, you could drop that loop on the right, middle side down at least twelve inches to give you room to squeeze in and access or better reach into that back corner.

[Wiredup]

actually, your right, I forgot about reaches...

however the great part about my room is that the top right corner and lower left are both adjacent to doorways. so I do have access to both sides. This is especially important in the top right section.

I'm avg build, but my lil step stool has given me enough reach to get anywhere on the layout as it, and so far I've had no problems reaching everything. The benchwork is pretty much the same, aside from the loop on the right, and the added triangle of benchwork on the lower left... (which I'm a lil scared about for room access as thats the main door way duck under!)


As for the over/unders on the layout itself... the tracks that run North of the terminal are acending, so that first meeting on the left side of the layout is the trakcs comming from the top left are elevated. I plan on using a pair of Walthers Double Track Truss bridges here... or maybe just one once I start construction..but we will see.

The crossing over on the right side of the layout is a bit more complicated. The rails running from the lower corner to the inside of the benchwork will elevate at a grade, while the tracks going under it will burrow... kinda like an overpass.

Both these scenarios should do a good job of keeping the high lines in the back of the layout... the only time that will be affected is on the left side of the layout. I'll know more once I get the track plan onto the benchwork.