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Hi All...
OK, so in the course of building a model railroad, I have learned that sometimes when you walk in the room and are no longer inspired by your original thoughts, it is time to rethink things...
For those of you who followed my original thread over in the HO section ( http://www.the-gauge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=271), much thanks for all the great comments and encouragement along the way...
So why the deconstruct and remake? There were 2 BIG things bothering me about the setup I was building up... first and foremost, the layout had a single track running throughout the entire layout with some very poorly designed sidings. I was able to get some nice pictures but operationally it was terrible. Second, I had 2 workbenches in the room, one was mine for the RR and the other was my wifes for scrapbooking. Those tables took up about 30% of the usable space in the room (20x12).
What I did... I moved the tables out into the room next to the layout room... I really wanted to have a "complete" trainroom complete with workbench, but after seeing much space I lost, I realized the 20 ft. walk to the other side of the laundry room was worth getting valuable bench space back for. Next I re-engineered the benchwork to use the new found space. So the new dimensions of the benchwork are 20' x 28" along the back wall, 9 1/2' x 24" along the "west" wall, a run from the west wall that is 14' x 50", 9 1/2' x 26" along the "east" wall which opens up to about 60" wide to accomodate the turn around. The aisle ways are 28" heading to the sump closet, 32" between the "west" and "east" segements and 30" along the back wall. (I probably did a really bad job of describing the room, so some pictures of the blank canvas follow).
During deconstruction I saved as much of the scenery as I could for re-use if/when/where applicable. I am *very* excited about the 20' run... I think I can do some really cool stuff there (yard, small town, who knows?!?)...
So step 1 is complete, the benchwork from the previous layout was reused where possible and the new pieces were added. Now for step 2, getting the track back down! I will be staying with the open grid style using risers to elevate the track attached to plywood, but this time I bought some slightly heavier plywood that is sanded on one side, I think it will make for a smoother run and more durable installation and it was only a couple bucks more a sheet.
Anyways, not much now, but I am excited again about building so I expect to see some progress quickly (not to mention the basement is cooler than it is outside!)
--Rob.
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Rob ...
I am preparing to build benchwork for a new layout (after a 20 year hiatus) and will be watching you like a hawk! I must admit to being a "L"-girder fan, as I've used them before and they do the job.
Keep posting the photos ... I'm a visual kind of guy!
I'd stay and babble some more, but I must get back to work on my Structure Challenge project if I expect to meet the September 7 deadline! Stay cool in the basement!
biL
Lehigh Susquehanna & Western
"America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." ~~Abraham Lincoln
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Rob,
Looks like you are off to agreat start on your new layout!!
Do you have a track plan yet for the new layout or are you just going to wing it??
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Great looking benchwork, Rob. I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes.
Three Foot Rule In Effect At All Times
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I really like working with this style benchwork... easy to build and leaves things wide open to work with.
As far as a track plan, I have some rough sketches, but I am starting on the "ends" because I know exactly what I want there (as a matter of fact I got about 40% of the sub-roadbed attached last night on the one end and hope to finish that side today. What I really am not sure on yet is the long 20' run along the back wall, I am thinking a yard, some industry, maybe a small town... just not sure yet... the one thing, while I think they look awesome on a layout, is that I will not build a large city, because the theme is "New England in Autumn TIme", and based on my trips to Vermont in the past, a big city, well that just doesn't exist... farms, mountains, small towns with a general store, dirt roads leading to the hidden covered bridge, but yet I will probably take some freedom with a yard or smaller industrial area... in short, not totally sure yet other than the "ends" of the layout.
--Rob.
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Great looking benchwork..!! 
Benchwork is one of my favorite parts of layout building, and I like to see how other folks do theirs. I've been tinkering with the idea of doing some "major surgery" on a part of my layout before I go on to the "final phase" (Is anything ever "final" in this business..??) I'll be keeping an eye on your progress to see how much I can steal from you.... 
Gus (LC&P).
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Quote:As far as a track plan, I have some rough sketches, but I am starting on the "ends" because I know exactly what I want there (as a matter of fact I got about 40% of the sub-roadbed attached last night on the one end and hope to finish that side today. What I really am not sure on yet is the long 20' run along the back wall, I am thinking a yard, some industry, maybe a small town... just not sure yet... the one thing, while I think they look awesome on a layout, is that I will not build a large city, because the theme is "New England in Autumn TIme", and based on my trips to Vermont in the past, a big city, well that just doesn't exist... farms, mountains, small towns with a general store, dirt roads leading to the hidden covered bridge, but yet I will probably take some freedom with a yard or smaller industrial area... in short, not totally sure yet other than the "ends" of the layout.
I may be guilty of overplanning, or getting that 'analysis paralysis', but I still recommend you step away from the benchwork and do some dreaming and sketching and planning. Otherwise you may be in for yet another rebuild. If you enjoy tearing it out and rebuilding, that's fine. But spending a little time with pencil and paper can save hours of work down the road and heighten the enjoyment of building and operating the railroad.
I've just hit a point in my own layout construction where I realized I hadn't spent much time with the scenery planning. I'm not going to go so far as to build a mini-mock-up of the layout, but I do want to spend a little more time deciding a few of the more concrete details in the scenes. I've had a general idea what I'd like each scene to represent, but it's time to think about the specifics like roads, elevations & major structures like bridges & such.
Anyway, I don't mean to be a killjoy or break your stride, especially when you do such good work on scenery and want desperately to get to that point ASAP. But which would you prefer, an ounce of prevention or a pound of cure?
Whatever you decide, I'm looking forward to seeing the progress!
Galen
I may not be a rivet counter, but I sure do like rivets!
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What era are you planning to model? It may have been covered in the previous thread, but I didn't try to read through page after page to find it. I ask because a lot of small industries shipped product and received raw materials by rail until the interstate highway system was built during the Eisenhower administration back in the 1950's. Basically when the best East West route was Route 66, and every town the highway ran through had traffic lights for trucks to deal with, long distance trucking was not really competitive with rail. Therefore if you are modeling early 1950's or before, the part of New England you are modeling might have a small furniture manufacturer, perhaps a bottler of maple syrup, small textile mills all shipping by rail. With the advent of the interstate highway system and the ability to drive coast to coast without dealing with slowing for cities or having to stop for traffic lights, a lot of that business went to trucking companies. Today much of the business went to china!
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Galen: I have actually spent the last 3 or so weeks walking into the room, staring at the benchwork, taking measurements with a tape measure, going to the computer room, plugging some thoughts into Empire Express, wash, rinse, repeat... I am happy with my design at the ends of the layout, it is the middle that I am still thinking through... so with that in mind I decided to actually start some construction while at the same time thinking about the middle... but yes, I agree with you completely that not doing some sort of planning will result in yet another teardown... my uncle who used to build layouts once told me it is the natural cycle of things, design, build, love, hate, tear-down... my wife, however, disagrees with that and thinks I need to "do it right" once and leave it alone... we shall see!
Russ: Interesting question! I have decided that eras and prototypes are, in this train room, up for complete interpretation. I have noticed in my past visits to Vermont that most of that state seems to be "stuck in time"... lots of old general stores, small craftsman "industries", undersized roadways, etc. You also see a Green Mountain GP-38 pass by once in awhile! So, my interpretation involves a little bit of the old, some of the new, and a railroad where Conrail and the Green Mountain RR work together. Basically, a fictitious world based loosely on the real world, set somewhere in the 90's. There will be some this is what is was, this is what it is, and this is what I thought it should have been. I know some modelers would probably cringe at that thought, but I am afraid based on the way I like to research things if I tried to make it "too real" I would never build and merely read and probably get caught in an endless loop of "how do I implement this". Truthfully my New England, specifically Vermont, inspiration is based on fall foliage rather than period specific details.
OK... time to don the crummy clothes and get back down to the basement!
Thanks for following along and thanks for the comments!
--Rob.
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Glad you're thinking, Rob. It makes all the difference in the world! And, as usual, thanks for sharing the progress!
Galen
I may not be a rivet counter, but I sure do like rivets!
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Robert - may I call you Bob?
I like your concept, as described in the paragraph addressing a question by Russ. As Galen said, it shows that you are thinking and in my way of thinking, those that don't think often find themselves with a layout that doesn't hold their interest because it has no "thought" behind it. (And that ain't no snake oil double-speak, there, son!)
Your plan sounds interesting to me. And with New England-esque scenery and small-town architecture (maybe even the colors of September and October,) if the track plan is all about moving freight from manufacturer to market, you just might have a layout that holds your interest for years.
And really, no offense to your wife, but those not involved in the hobby don't understand the hobby. I mean, even God didn't get it right the first time ... or why is there evolution, as living things continue to evolve and adapt to their surroundings?
Keep the faith, Brother! And your approach to layout building will improve with each new confrontation of the problem.
But ... keep verbalizing ... It not only helps you by putting it out there where you can look at it and re-evaluate it, but we out here in Big Blue Forum land also gain benefit from discussing the modeling problems faced by you and others.
biL
Lehigh Susquehanna & Western
"America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." ~~Abraham Lincoln
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RobL Wrote:Russ: Interesting question! I have decided that eras and prototypes are, in this train room, up for complete interpretation. I have noticed in my past visits to Vermont that most of that state seems to be "stuck in time"... lots of old general stores, small craftsman "industries", undersized roadways, etc. You also see a Green Mountain GP-38 pass by once in awhile! So, my interpretation involves a little bit of the old, some of the new, and a railroad where Conrail and the Green Mountain RR work together. Basically, a fictitious world based loosely on the real world, set somewhere in the 90's. There will be some this is what is was, this is what it is, and this is what I thought it should have been. I know some modelers would probably cringe at that thought, but I am afraid based on the way I like to research things if I tried to make it "too real" I would never build and merely read and probably get caught in an endless loop of "how do I implement this". Truthfully my New England, specifically Vermont, inspiration is based on fall foliage rather than period specific details.
OK... time to don the crummy clothes and get back down to the basement!
Thanks for following along and thanks for the comments!
--Rob.
Rob, it sounds good! One of the options of model railroading is that we can model "what should have been" instead of what happened. If we like modern equipment, but don't like that all but the largest shippers are using trucks instead of trains, in our world, the freight can still move by train! You mentioned the GP-38. If you are modeling a modern branch rather than the mainline class one, you can get more in by using a smaller minimum radius if you are careful about what modern cars you run, and stick to 4 axle power. The part of the railroad dedicated to the class one mainline can be of a larger minimum radius to allow for modern super power locomotives, but the branch can be restricted to shorter locomotives and rolling stock. If the radius is too short for 89 foot boxcars, run modern 50 foot high cubes. You can probably get a nice selection of fairly modern cars that are under 65 feet in length.
If you haven't heard about the emag published free by Joe Fugate called Model Railroad Hobbyist, look it up. Issue #1 had an interesting article with photos showing how curve radius effects operation of various lengths of rolling stock.
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Russ: The minimum radius is 22", but mostly 24" and greater. My largest piece of rolling stock is the good old 50' boxcar, so the 22" and greater radius will have no problem with that. For some reason, I don't like the looks of the 86' boxcars, they seem "too long" to me...
Here are some progress pictures... I know some of you guys love working on benchwork and whatnot, but it is probably my least favorite thing to do... I cannot wait until this "phase" is complete, yet I am trying not to rush it and get myself in a "bad" spot wanting to redo parts before it the screws even cool off 
As a side note, I downloaded an inclinometer app for my iPhone... it is pretty cool for checking the grade % as I go along... I am trying to stay in 1-2%, some 3% and very little 4% if possible, and reworking things that end up 5% or greater...
--Rob.
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Rob,
For a phase you hate you sure are moving quickly!!
Looks like you should be having some track to runaround here pretty soon 
Keep up the great work!!
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Rob,
That benchwork looks great! One would never know it's one of your least favorite things to do.
-Dave
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