Adventures in Perspective

[Sumpter250]

I like that. The backdrop's horizon is low enough to the level of the layout, that it shouldn't be too big a distraction.

Another thought: Half trees.
Paint a tree on the backdrop ( or paste a photo ), and put "half a tree" on the layout in front of it, but use that sparingly, there would only be, but a very few trees, that would happen to grow "on that line", and matching the foliage color to the painting/photo wouldn't be all that easy. The oil painter's trick of painting the "back half" a dark green,or black, and the foreground or front, lighter, might also work.
A few of those might help disguise the layout/backdrop boundary.

[Gary S]

Reinhard, thanks for the look. The angle that I used for the photo makes the perspective work. Once you move to the left or right, the perspective is broken. But that is where S-2-fiddy's trick of "half trees" comes in. There will be some trees immediately to the left and coming out from the backdrop to block the view from the left, and there will be big trees out around the tracks on the right, to help block that perspective.

S-2-fiddy, I'll definitely be using some of those kinds of trees!

[faraway]

... The angle that I used for the photo makes the perspective work. ... There will be some trees...

Gary, I think it is important to have the right perspective if you are looking along the bayou at the "standard" height. All other points of view are subject to some kind of camouflage like trees etc. You can not do anything substantial about that. It's the physics...

[Gary S]

I'm not exactly sure what you mean, but in the photos in this thread, I have tried to keep the camera at the typical viewpoint of an average height person running trains - that is, about 66 inches above the floor and looking straight down the bayou. With the layout height at 58 inches, trees will make an effective viewblock.

Here's an overhead diagram of where the trees will be. A bit of trigonometry says that trees within 6 inches of the backdrop could be less than 2" tall to block the view, at 12 inches from the backdrop, they would need to be about 3" tall.

   

[faraway]

Gary, you described what I meant. The yellow arrow is the view along the bayou and 66 inch is your "standard" height. I think that is the view where the perspective of the backdrop painting should be aligned to. The red views must be taken as is or blocked with trees etc.

Trees of 2" and 3° height are rather small for scale 1:87. You are enforcing perspective very much may be to much. Because the buildings (e.g. the bank building) are at the backdrop too the trees should match them too. I would go without enforced perspective by scale reduction (e.g. 2" trees) but use faded colors at the background to create distance.

[Gary S]

Glad to see we are on the same page.

I agree with you on the tree height. I won't be forcing the perspective, because as you mention, the model buildings along the backdrop are full HO size, so the trees need to be HO scale too. I was just explaining that even a minimum size tree would help with blocking the view.

[P5se Camelback]

Gary ... once again as I read along in this thread, I get that "knowing smile!"

It is all coming together quite nicely! (Gary is looking and seeing ... and doing ... and doing quite convincingly!)

This bayou vignette will be a tough act to follow!

... and Pete ... you took me totally by surprise with your comment re: the "implying depth to an object" tricks of fine artists! But using them here is a concept that is right on! (Did you watch those Jon Nagy "How-To Art Shows" on "Saturday morning occupy-the-kids' TV" back in the late fifties/early sixties? That's the type of artists' tricks he used to show us kids how to do. I'm amazed I even remembered that just now!)
And the use of judiciously-placed trees as "casual" view-blocks is absolutely brilliant, Gary!

[Sumpter250]

... and Pete ... you took me totally by surprise with your comment re: the "implying depth to an object" tricks of fine artists! But using them here is a concept that is right on! (Did you watch those Jon Nagy "How-To Art Shows" on "Saturday morning occupy-the-kids' TV" back in the late fifties/wearly sixties? That's the type of artists' tricks he used to show us kids how to do. I'm amazed I even remembered that just now!)

Abso....bleeping...lutely !!!!!............and I haven't heard the name Jon Nagy, in all those years since !!
I learn well, the things I hear, as opposed to things I read, or see. I wouldn't have been able to properly identify it to that source, but that is where I learned a lot of what I know now.

edit--- was that John Gnagy ??..........I seem to remember the name as "not that simple" ?
When in doubt, google it.......Mar 10, 1981 ... John Gnagy, a painter who gave drawing lessons on NBC-TV and CBS-TV from the late 1940's to the mid-1950's, died Saturday at his home in ........ that was thirty years ago !!

[Gary S]

I'm gonna need a bunch of them "implying depth" tricks!

I took a bunch more background photos, unfortunately it was a dreary day, but on the other hand, maybe that will help me stay "faded and far away" instead of picking out the details shown by a bright sunny day. I parked by the edge of various fields, stood in the bed of my truck, and overlapped the photos. I took a set at normal focus and a set at zoom. Then printed them out and cut the photos into usable rectangles. From there, tried different tree heights to see what would look good.

This is the one I like best for behind the bayou. It has a natural slope of the horizon from right to left, like the ground is naturally sloping to the bayou. There is a modeled building to the right (brown rectangle) and there will be a couple 18 wheelers against the backdrop, backed up to the loading dock . This will cover the backdrop/layout junction there. The building on the left is painted backdrop, the edge will be behind model trees.

I won't try to paint the photo exactly, but will use it for just the overall shape and horizontal lines. Hopefully I will keep the detail down and the colors faded so as to "stay in the distance" rather than become a focal point, as we have discussed.

   

[Gary S]

Digital cameras and photoshop programs are such a great tool. Sure helps us non-artists to visualize things. I didn't take any pains with the colors, that will be worked out during the painting.

   

[P5se Camelback]

Pete ... you are so right! I'm sitting, but I will "stand corrected" ... I was wrong!

(Write that on the calendar, Judy!)

But I was such a devoted little Saturday morning art student back then, never missing an episode of "Jon Gnagy's Learn to Draw." The die had already been cast at a very young age! I even pestered my parents until they finally bought me a Jon Gnagy Learn to Draw "Basic Set."

And now, as I prepare to post this, I see Gary has been at it again ... and by George, this time, I think he's got it!

[Gary S]

Thanks biL. I'm thinking the overall feel of this one is quite good. Hopefully tomorrow I will get off work early enough to get more lines penciled in on the backdrop. Let's keep our fingers crossed that I can pull this off.

[P5se Camelback]

I have every confidence!

[ocalicreek]

Missed this thread, somehow. Anyway, it's just SUPER! Keep on doing what's working and you'll be fine. I'll be revisiting these backdrop threads to be sure once I'm ready to begin painting.

Galen

[rrinker]

I'm kind of thinking it would be good just as it is - stitch those photos together and print that out as the backdrop. The dreary day really helps enhance the illusion of distance, and keeps them from looking too much like what they are - photos of trees.

--Randy