Adventures in Perspective
#76
Hi Gary,

Not to change your approach (results are absolutely great!), but I wondered if you had considered N- or Z-scale flats for backdrop buildings? There was an article in MR not that long ago about using photos of models for backdrops. That, combined with the selective compression and forced-perspective discussions on Big Blue made me think about smaller scale flats as backdrops.


Andrew
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#77
I suppose I had dismissed the ideawithout giving it a thought. But now that you mention it and make me think about it, it might work. And I wouldn't necessarily be limited to n-scale. I could scratchbuild whatever size would be appropriate, as the buildings are quite simple. So here is the plan - I'll go ahead and paint the building on for now, then perhaps I will build a flat which can go over the painting to see what effect it gives.

I just pulled out some foam core to do a quick mock-up, and the first thing that popped in my head was how to do the area under the building which will be parking lot. In other words, the bottom of the building will be about 6.4 mm above the layout, the parking lot underneath will have to stick out from the wall too, but that will leave an edge on the left side of the parking lot - not sure how to camoflage that.
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#78
I think it might be a challenge to get the colours right - you'd be relying more on the size to give the appearance of distance. But it also might make the background appear more distant because of that. ie. the brain will assume anything more clear and detailed is nearer, and less detailed and indistinct is further away.

I'd be interested to see what that painted bridge would look like as a flat, even if the supports remain painted (now there's a challenging combo...!).


Andrew
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#79
Not that I know anything about this sort of thing, but...
I would extend the painted background building on the right to a bit behind and to the left of the foreground trees, and make the trees smaller to be just a bit less "obtrusive". I feel there is a "break" in the background between the left and right sides caused by the trees...

Just a thought.... Goldth
Gus (LC&P).
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#80
faraway Wrote:I suggest to stay with at least one building in the background. While this industry area is only light populated only green in the background would be misleading. That would be the right touch for a single (industry) building in an otherwise unpopulated area.
I understand the background building in the same way as you use the faded colors at the backdrop. The faded colors are false but they give the right impression.

Thanks for those thoughts, Reinhard. That's the same reason I put the "really far away" buildings to the left of the bayou. There just needs to be some structures in the backdrop - and probably more than what I havedone.
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#81
I think that the thing which "throws me off" on the building is that its distance from the viewer is ambiguous. Normally, that would be a good thing, but the painting technique makes it appear as if it's some distance away, while its positioning suggests that it's much closer. I think that a strip of painted ground (or roadway/parking lot) between the base of the backdrop building and the modelled parking lot would improve the perspective - try moving the building up an inch or two. I do agree that the building should be included, if possible, as it places the foreground more in context with its surroundings.

Wayne
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#82
Wow, you guys are giving me lots of things to try! Smile

As per Andrew's suggestion, I made a quick flat and stuck it in place. The main issue I see is where it butts against the 3D building. It can't really go behind, because that pushes the 3D building forward. And if it butts against it, it will just look funny, like it is built into the foreground building, with the 2nd story of the foreground building built on top of the flat.

   

   
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#83
Gus, I agree that the trees break the backdrop scene into two pieces. I was thinking that was a good thing, but now I will have to reconsider. Perhaps some shorter trees as you suggest will give a different feel. I'll have to try that. I'll also see about extending the building to the left.

docWayne, back to the painted building... the paper mock-up is taped to the backdrop about 1/4" above the layout right now. I'm afraid to move it up too much, as the painted backdrop building on the other side of the bayou is making me think they need to be about the same height. I agree that the building under discussion is a bit "ambiguously" spaced in the distance. I had drawn up a couple of the buildings in various sizes, and then also varied the door size to suggest it was further away, and it didn't seem to matter much.

I'll try all these suggestions and see what we have.
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#84
Gary, the quick flat works too but it is a total different story.
While the flat looks like at on the same lot as the main building is the painted/faded building much more far away.
It depends what you want to show, a second building close to the first or just another building in the same industry area. I assume the later is what you go for.
Reinhard
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#85
I agree. The background building is supposed to be across the street and with a parking lot in between.
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#86
Thanks to everyone for throwing out the ideas and giving me plenty to think about.

As per Gus, here is the building extended further left. Didn't want to go too far left as it seems to be getting too close to the bayou.

   

And per docWayne, moved the building up just abit:

   

And tried it with a smaller building:

   
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#87
Gary...Are the pictures taken from your normal viewing height..?? I ask because I "scrunched" down to view the scene from rail height, and it improved. That leads me to think you might try raising the horizon a bit...
I think the background building looks fine with the "stretch" beyond the trees. I still think you might try to shrink those trees a bit, and put a wee-bit more color on the building. The contrast with your "real" flat is a bit much....
Gus (LC&P).
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#88
Gus, I am 6'-4" and the photos were taken from my normal viewing height. What is average height, about 5'-10"? So most people's eyes will be about 6" lower than mine. Now, I have a question, how did you scrunch down to look over the rails? :?

On the buildng colors, this is a piece of paper that is colored with colored pencils, so not painted yet. I do figure the building will end up with muted colors similar to the paper building.
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#89
Well...I just scrunched down from my normal angle viewing the monitor to get a more perpendicular perspective...

I was thinking just now that I might try your method of using "pasties" :oops: to start planning my background. I've got most of the panels prepped for the blue-white step, but I haven't the faintest clue how I'm going to fill the rest with a SW desert landscape...I'm going to get me some poster board and crayons, and do me a little doodling this weekend.... Goldth
Gus (LC&P).
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#90
I like colored drawing pencils, but for bigger areas, the crayons should work fine. Do you have photos of the desert SW? How about an image search on Google? I assume you will be painting the backdrop? Perhaps a google search on "painting desert" and the like will turn up some good tips and pointers.

Mmmm... pasties....
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