Selective Compression

[shortliner]

IMO In My Opinion?
YMMV ????? I couldnt decipher this one.
and there was one other, FWIW, has got me beat.

IMO is correct
YMMV = Your mileage (views) may vary
FWIW = For what it is worth

[Brakie]

But in N scale, a mile (5280 feet) is still fairly long - 33 feet instead of the 60 feet it would have been in H0 scale.
----------------------------------------
And that might be more of a "expert" trap then a necessary-why even bother to worry about 60' as a mile since the average non-Godzilla size layout struggles to be a 1/2 mile and a ISL even less?

Here's the ticket..We should use our space wisely and selective compression should never be used to cram more track or buildings in a small space.IMHO Reinhard has found a excellent balance for selective compression and his photos shows a fully believable result that shows industries that actually look like they need rail service.

Maybe we need to rethink selective compression in a more realistic manner instead of being sheepeople lead by "experts" that still believes in more track and compress industries is better?

There is several excellent ISL plans in the layout section that follows the "Mindheim" disciplines of ISL planning and the best use of selective compression for large industrial buildings that looks like they need rail severice..

[shortliner]

Mark

IMO In My Opinion?
YMMV ????? I couldnt decipher this one.
and there was one other, FWIW, has got me beat.

IMO is correct
also IMHO =In my humble opinion
YMMV = Your mileage may vary
YVMD = Your views may differ
FWIW = For what its worth
HIH = Hope it helps

Jack

[steinjr]

Mark

IMO In My Opinion?
YMMV ????? I couldnt decipher this one.
and there was one other, FWIW, has got me beat.

IMO is correct
also IMHO =In my humble opinion
YMMV = Your mileage may vary
YVMD = Your views may differ
FWIW = For what its worth
HIH = Hope it helps

LOL (Laughing Out Loud) :-)

Sorry about the jargon.

Grin,
Stein

[Sumpter250]

and a "backdrop building", is ------- an industry that you selected to "compress" the depth of. , in some cases, to no more than the thickness of the wall, or wall and loading platform.

In the end what gets compressed ( must ????? ) ---- should, be a reasonably functional representation, that looks "right", and serves the purpose of the actual industry, while still fitting into the overall space available.
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Brakie, wrote:
" Here's the ticket..We should use our space wisely and selective compression should never be used to cram more track or buildings in a small space. "

[Russ Bellinis]

I don't know how I missed this discussion. There is a lot of interesting information here.

"The UPY SW1500 did not run alone prior to 2008. It was mostly used as the third engine..."

Reinhard, I retired in 2006. Prior to retirement, I was the primary mechanic doing service of transport refrigeration equipment on the road. I spent a lot of time in Orange County working in the Anaheim, Buena Park, and Fullerton areas. I used to see a most of the U.P. Sw10 (I think that was their designation for the Sw1500's with the Gp9 nose grafted on the end) working singly on the various industrial branches in that area. I seldom saw the Sw's after about 2000. I think they pretty much retired the Sw units as they moved to using remote control for switching. The Santa Fe used two unit sets of Gp's for switching, but I think that may be because the Santa Fe kept their locomotives on the roster and rebuilt them more often whereas the U.P. seems to trade off older units more often instead of rebuilding.

In the city of Industry, where the shop was located, The U.P. would use two and three engines on local switching jobs, and more often than not, two of the three units would be Dash 8-40c's or Sd75's with the third being a Gp40-2. Of course a typically "local" switch job in that area would have 40-50 cars in the train to be switched out. I think the smallest facilities receiving rail service in that area typically would receive cuts of 4-5 cars at a time. There was one warehouse where I went to work on a trailer unit that had 100 loading doors for trucks on one side, and 10 on each end! I think the other side was rail served, and probably had room for a cut of 10 cars! I think that warehouse was close to a mile long!

[MountainMan]

Surprisingly, the most basic concept in this discussion appears to have been completely ignored. Let's call it "matching expectations to reality", or some other PC label for the moment.

What era and equipment do you opt to model? How does that compare to your available space? How well do your "expectations match your reality"?

I have limited space; therefore, although I am working in N-scale, I am also working in an era that means smaller locomotives, smaller consists and sharper curves. The amount of selective compression I may have to apply is as little as possible, because most of the structures of the time are not massive, either, and my style of modeling allows me to include large industries using minimal space without the need for any compression.

It would have made no sense for me to attempt to model a huge, modern railway in action in such a limited space - about 110 sq ft - with sweeping large radii turns, long yards, huge locos and equipment and gigantic factory buildings, so I made a realistic choice that allows me to avoid all of that compression while staying faithful to my original concept.

Selective compression is a symptom of trying to match unrealistic expectations to existing reality in an artistically acceptable fashion. Something has to give.

[Brakie]

and a "backdrop building", is ------- an industry that you selected to "compress" the depth of. , in some cases, to no more than the thickness of the wall, or wall and loading platform.

In the end what gets compressed ( must ????? ) ---- should, be a reasonably functional representation, that looks "right", and serves the purpose of the actual industry, while still fitting into the overall space available.
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Brakie, wrote:
" Here's the ticket..We should use our space wisely and selective compression should never be used to cram more track or buildings in a small space. "

You missed the point..That building could 4-6" out from the brackdrop and 24-30" long so,its not really "compress" like it would be if it was a stand alone industry.-Savvy?

Think of the car spots and detail you could add.

[faraway]

...What era and equipment do you opt to model? How does that compare to your available space? How well do your "expectations match your reality"?...

You are so right. I wish I could argue but I got lost with high cube boxcars and Genset MUs. Those "monsters" eat all my space.
I did uncounted attempts with 40' boxcars and ATSF Zebra GP7, 50' boxcars and MP15 but I am still in love with high cube boxcars and Genset. I am afraid I am lost hock:

[steinjr]

Surprisingly, the most basic concept in this discussion appears to have been completely ignored. Let's call it "matching expectations to reality", or some other PC label for the moment.

Also known as "compressive selection" (see Byron's blog posts above) - choose to model smaller scenes and objects, instead of applying extreme "selective compression" to larger scenes and objects. Or as Reinhard formulated it in one of his posts above : "careful selection [is] an alternative to selective compression".

Going back in time is certainly one very valid way of doing that - to the times when cars were shorter, engines smaller, and labor cost lower, so more traffic was in short trains and single car switching.

Smile,
Stein

[Brakie]

...What era and equipment do you opt to model? How does that compare to your available space? How well do your "expectations match your reality"?...

You are so right. I wish I could argue but I got lost with high cube boxcars and Genset MUs. Those "monsters" eat all my space.
I did uncounted attempts with 40' boxcars and ATSF Zebra GP7, 50' boxcars and MP15 but I am still in love with high cube boxcars and Genset. I am afraid I am lost hock:

Reinhard,Please don't sell your layout achievements short..
As I mention earlier you found a excellent "selective compression" balance.

IMHO that balance spells believability in 50' letters- even with high cubes and Gensets.

[kamerad47]

I think the the selective compression depemds on what you are try to build ? If you are into modern stuff & using a class 1 RR it's hard ! , But if you are into short lines lke the ( Burlington junction RR, Tyburn RR or the Lapeer RR ) They use old a center cab switchers ( 44 , 45 or 70 ton) or old sw 1200 etc. & the do a lot of transloading ( flour , sugar, plastics, wallboard, paper, all kinds of tank cars , scrap , lumber etc.) on a small siding or small yard or a section of track to park 1 car & unload into a vacum bulk tank truck. That is what I'm building 4" x 1' with a cassette to pickup 8 cars The back story is 3 buildings againts the back drop 1st co. is a cardboard recycler 1 high cube boxcar 2nd is a pipe joint compund Co. 1 tank car , the 3rd co. the RR owns the wharehouse & leasse' s the bulding to 2 Co.'s International foods 1 door & Beer dist. at the 2nd door the rest are transload spots 1 tank car for corn suyrup , 1 plastics hopper , 1 covered hopper of pumince & a scrap gondola they load from truck to RR car. I'm using a 44 ton & a 45 ton switcher, it takes a good hour to swith the cars out ,this is HO. There is only 1 thing wrong right now , no bulk tanker trailer I hope somene will make one someday!!

[BR60103]

Another factor:
Your viewing width. With a certain distance from your eyes to the layout, you see only a certain width, say, 30". If the building is wider than that, it looks to go on forever, or at least on one side.

[faraway]

Selecting a time, location and operation that fits the available space is a frequent given advise. My "Genset addiction" did not very well fit my space. I am therefor willing to give it a try and jump back in time to the "Zebra time". That might be also a nice project for 2012 to get everything else on the layout aligned to the late 1950'th.
You see a quick test shot after engines, cars and automobiles have been swapped.

[shortliner]

I think the the selective compression depemds on what you are try to build ? If you are into modern stuff & using a class 1 RR it's hard ! , But if you are into short lines lke the ( Burlington junction RR, Tyburn RR or the Lapeer RR ) They use old a center cab switchers ( 44 , 45 or 70 ton) or old sw 1200 etc. & the do a lot of transloading ( flour , sugar, plastics, wallboard, paper, all kinds of tank cars , scrap , lumber etc.) on a small siding or small yard or a section of track to park 1 car & unload into a vacum bulk tank truck. That is what I'm building 4" x 1' with a cassette to pickup 8 cars The back story is 3 buildings againts the back drop 1st co. is a cardboard recycler 1 high cube boxcar 2nd is a pipe joint compund Co. 1 tank car , the 3rd co. the RR owns the wharehouse & leasse' s the bulding to 2 Co.'s International foods 1 door & Beer dist. at the 2nd door the rest are transload spots 1 tank car for corn suyrup , 1 plastics hopper , 1 covered hopper of pumince & a scrap gondola they load from truck to RR car. I'm using a 44 ton & a 45 ton switcher, it takes a good hour to swith the cars out ,this is HO. There is only 1 thing wrong right now , no bulk tanker trailer I hope somene will make one someday!!

I'd be interested to see a trackplan, my friend ,and I think there has recently been a re-release of a bulk tanker trailer kit by a Canadian manufacturer- there was a photo in the 1/87 vehicle club pages but I can't find it It was mentiond on a forum in the last few days