QRL&PCo Boxcars

[sailormatlac]

Once again, I strike back with MDC boxcars. But this time, I'm trying to reproduce a QRL&PCo prototype in HO. I had an interesting discussion about it with Doctorwayne earlier this year and now I feel I have enough information to tackle the project. I would like to thank Thomas Grumley, Doctorwayne, Ian Cranstone, Jean Breton and Denis Jalbert for their invaluable help. Without them, this project would have been impossible.

QRL&PCo boxcars were an oddity when they were retired from revenue service in the mid-50's. Most of them were old 36' wood boxcar, some with truss rods underframe and even a few 34' boxcars. According to photographic evidences and ORER, one can retrace a plausible story behind these museum pieces.

QRL&PCo was a well-know monopoly in transportation and energy (gas, electricity, domestic appliances, name it) in Quebec City area. Respected and hated equally, it had absolutely no rival and felt no threat until the parent company, the Shawinigan Power, was nationalized to end the unscrupulous price policy of the company. Rail service in the northeastern Quebec Area was lucrative but on limited scale. Topography and geography would have made the arrival of a rival company unlikely. QRL&PCo only owned the first section, leaving the eastern most subdivion (Murray Bay) into CNR care. They originally planned to build it, but it was financially unwise. Politicians worked hard to get it done, at a high cost!

In these condition, QRL&PCo had absolutely no reason to replace its old cars which saw limited interchange (if not!). They only rebuilt them when necessary. A few of them were in revenue service for 63 years!!! Could it be what they mean about a "green business policy"!!! By the way, an original Jackson & Sharp coach was still preserved (rotting) at Steamtown until few years ago and was for sale. I don't know what happened, but I must saw it's a shame it didn't end up at Saint-Constant Museum. This coach was part of what was called "The Good St. Anne's Train", a famous pilgrim service that existed from 1889 to 1959 and carried millions of Canadians and Americans.

Few boxcar series existed, I'll try, at least, to represent a few of them. All cars were rebuilt with lap seam roof. I will probably model about 10-12 of them. Finding good decals will be the hardest challenge. Paying for custom decals would be overkill. What do you think? Maybe I should since I'll have well over 20 QRL&PCo cars to do in the near future.

Cars 1001-1015 were 34' boxcars with wood ends and truss rod undeframe. I have good reasons to believe they are from the original rolling stock bought in 1889. They were rebuilt in 1918 and were retired in 1952. Pocher/AHM old time boxcar is a good stand in for it and I'm actually in the process of kitbashing one. They wore the 1918 paint scheme until the end. They ran on archbar trucks.

This photo is taken from 1959 Omer Lavallée's brochure. The car I'm talking about is the one in the background that we only see the end.


This photo is taken from Château-Richer's Archives. According to the disrepair state of houses behind the cars, it was shot somewhere between 1950 and 1952 when they started "urban renewal" and destroyed Henderson Street, Ramsay Street and Place d'Orléans' market in front of Palace Station. Another great stupid move from the postwar era. My father remembers when he was working in this borough during the 60's and 70's. Each week, a new suspicious fire started in an abandonned building. Sooner or later, everything was gone.


Cars 1016-1029 were the biggest 36' boxcars the railway owned. They were rebuilt between 1925 to 1927 by Canadian Equipment Co. An educated guess would place their original built date in early 1900's. Excellent pictures from the builder exist and will provided enough data to reproduce the paint scheme which seems to have been boxcar brown. They were retired between 1952 and 1953. The rebuilt version had composite ends and steel undeframe. They ran on trucks similar to Andrews. MDC/Roundhouse old time boxcar is an excellent starting point to model this serie.

Pictures are from Château-Richer's archives, donated by a former QRL&PCo employee's widow. This car serie is the best documented so far.




Cars 1100-1109 were 36' boxcars rebuilt in 1928 and retired in 1957. They kept their truss rod underframe and ran on trucks similar to Andrews. Car #1100 is the only one depicted in a color picture. At this time, it was painted in a bright orange color with white lettering. Data and company name were painted over, indicating it was now in company service. These cars had Murphy 7/8 ends. MDC/Roundhouse old time boxcar is an excellent starting point to model this serie.

This picture is photoshopped from Thomas Grumley's QRL&PCo, Montmorency Division book. His book is really worthy to buy, including great pictures of a long lost story.



Cars 1110-1119 were also 36's boxcars rebuilt in 1928 and retired in 1957. It is the only serie of boxcars I couldn't locate a sole picture. However, they were probably very similar to serie 1100. I wouldn't be surprised they had steel underframe. MDC/Roundhouse old time boxcar is an excellent starting point to model this serie. I probably won't model this serie. If I do so, I'll make they run on Bettendorf truck to have some variation. They probably were painted in the bright orange scheme too.

In the past, I modelled "created" serie 1200 to repaint 40' steel boxcar in QRL&PCo bright orange scheme. Many of you have probably spotted it in WPF.

I'm actually in the process of converting a MDC/Roundhouse (again!!!!!!!) 36' old time boxcar into serie 1100. It should be a straight forward conversion. Most work include modifying Tichy 8/7 Murphy Ends and altering the rood into a lap seam model. Andrews trucks are Tichy castings.

The donor is this Chicago St. Paul Minneapolis and Omaha boxcar:



The lettering was easily wiped out with 90% Alcohol. MDC/Roundhouse paint is really easy to strip, quickly and without strong products.



Cast on details were removed and roof plank seams were filled with automotive putty. It was a lame attempt at getting a smooth surface. I also thought about using .1mm styrene but it would also be to thick and difficult to cut around the roofwalk supports.



Meanwhile, metal stirrups were filed to make them look more thinner. I'll keep them since they are correct and bullet proof.




The roof was designed in AutoCAD, printed on high quality paper (recycled from the job) and cut to fit roofwalk supports. It was glued with CA. The first try didn't work. I put glue on the plastic roof and tried to paste the paper. Wrong!!!! Finally, I cut a another paper roof, put it in placed, then added the CA. Capilarity took care of the rest. Lap seams are made out of .2mm styrene strips. If you look carefully at the red pen doodles, you will recognize Lairet sub trackage! Honestly, I was in a hurry and didn't want to wait until tomorrow to get a blank sheet... I'll have to seal the ink with a lacquer because its water soluble.



The paper glued in place.



Lap seams applied according to the same method described in my MDC boxcars thread.



Lap seams cut to length with roofwalk put in place. Later generation Roundhouse cars had sharper details than their older siblings. It's a shame this company went under and was turned into a pricey ready-to-run spinoff.



The reassembled car with Tichy ends. Ends were shortened and adapted to the metal coupler pocket. A very straight forward operation. They will have to be enlarged with a styrene strip too.



All in all, this kitbash is easy to do. It shouldn't take a lot of time doing ten of them at the same time. However, about half of them will need new styrene undeframe because I have more shell than underframes.

Matt

[jwb]

The Kadee Andrews trucks are correct for some of those boxcars.

[sailormatlac]

The Kadee Andrews trucks are correct for some of those boxcars.

You're right, the Kadee Andrews are a perfect match. I'll consider equipping the 1100 serie with them. Thanks!

I started working on four other of them... Lots on fun... But now, my GERN tank car receive all my attention.

Matt

[doctorwayne]

While the Andrews trucks from Kadee are very nice, the ones from Accurail are equally nice and, at $1.25 a pair, a lot cheaper.




Wayne

[sailormatlac]

While the Andrews trucks from Kadee are very nice, the ones from Accurail are equally nice and, at $1.25 a pair, a lot cheaper.



Wayne

Indeed, they look good too. I didn't know Accurail made Andrews, though I'm quite a fan of their Bettendorf trucks.

I got some blank quality paper today. I'll be able to make more roofs without doodle. I started to shave off details from 4 other shells. However, most freight cars project will be left aside for a while since I have an upcoming academic paper to write in the next days. Anyway, tonight at club meeting, I was asked to complete CNR Avenue du Colisée bridge by next week. Too much projects, no more life... (euh, time!!!).

Matt

[modelsof1900]

Matt,
I love such freight car modifications getting new and unique car types. Let us share your modeling projects.
Thanks for your pictures and ideas.

[Russ Bellinis]

Actually, MDC didn't "go under." Their story was similar to Athearn's. The original owner of Roundhouse/Model Die Casting got old and wanted to retire from business. None of his kids wanted the company. His choice was to either just shut down and walk away, or to try to sell the company. Horizon bought it and integrated the products into Athearn as a separate line. Horizon did not want any of the left over kits, just the dies, tooling, etc. I knew of a man in the Carson City, Nevada area who bought all of the previous production either from MDC or from Horizon, and had the stuff in storage. I think he sold it off to someone else who boxed everything into kits for sale, but I've lost track of who now offers the left over kits.

[jwb]

Actually, Dr Wayne, there's a difference between Kadee and Accurail Andrews trucks. Here's a link to the Kadee version <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/380-509">http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/380-509</a><!-- m --> and here's a link to the Accurail version <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/112-103">http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/112-103</a><!-- m -->

The lower member beneath the journal on the Kadee style is angled to the rail, while the lower member on the Accurail is parallel to the rail. The Accurail model is very nice (though you do have to add metal wheels), but there are some prototypes where the Kadee is a better fit, including some of those QRL&P boxcars. The Kadee style was also very common on the SP.

[doctorwayne]

You're right, and there are also a couple of other styles of Andrews trucks available, including, I think, a Dalman Two-Level version. I have quite a few of the Kadee ones - their main drawback, in my opinion, is the scawny-looking spring package, as most prototype trucks used at least five springs in each sideframe. The "sprung" feature doesn't do much unless your cars are very heavy (8 to 10 oz. on the ones I tried ). I've seen suggestions about cementing styrene view blocks on the rear face of the sideframes, but many of mine are under cabooses. For these, I removed the Kadee coil springs and installed bronze leaf springs from PSC. The Kadee springs were then re-installed to help hold the leaf springs in place.




The Kadee sideframes are very nicely rendered, while the plastic ones from Accurail are, in my opinion, as well-done as any plastic truck on the market. As for adding metal wheels, I seldom bother - they don't roll any better and they're an awful lot more noisy. Kadee wheels, especially the casting info on their faces and the backs of the ribbed ones (appropriate up to about the mid-'50s) are very nice, but the wheel treads need to be polished to remove the blackening agent.

Wayne

[jwb]

I convereted to metal wheels when I discovered that longer trains on my current layout, which has curving grades, would stringline. Metal wheels add weight lower on the car, and their rolling qualities are better. They also keep the track cleaner.

[sailormatlac]

Bernhard: I've always been blown away by your fantastic old time modelling, it's a real pleasure to hear comment from you. Bashing cars and trying to bring to life long gone prototypes is always a thrilling experience.

Russ: I was talking about the old kits. But I agree with you. At least, the dies were saved and models are still available. In my heart, I wish to see, someday, the Harriman line back on track. It would be a tremendous source of kitbashes for many locomotives. I got a lot kits from this guy in Nevada years ago and I they are still selling them. In fact, most car you've seen in my thread came from him. I bought them when I first heard about original Roundhouse closing down. I'm glad I stock piled a few dozen of kits back then, they now are handy for many projects.

JWB & Wayne: Kadee Andrews are a very close match to QRL&PCo trucks. The member cross-section is both made with "T". At this point, I'm kitbashing over a dozen boxcars. Kadee wouldn't be the economical choice, but maybe I'll upgrade a few cars one day. A friend of mine recently gave me a pair of truck from a train set caboose distributed by True Line. It was the "good" old Life-Like die upgraded. The trucks are very nice and finely detailled Andrews prototype with leaf springs.

Matt

[doctorwayne]

Most of my layout is on curves and grades, and usually in the same places. While some of my newer cars have metal wheels, I see no reason to change out wheelsets if the plastic ones create no problems. Most of my trains are only 10 or 12 cars in length, but I've run ones in excess of 70 cars with no string-lining. If trackwork and rolling stock is in good condition, the main cause of stringlining is, I think, disparate car weights within the train, especially where light cars are near the front and heavy ones at the rear. Non-free-rolling cars at the wrong place in the train can certainly acerbate that. Most plastic trucks have metal axles, regardless of the wheel material, and if the axle/truck interface is of the correct geometry, the truck will be free-rolling. Kadee trucks have plastic axles, incidentally.
I do find metal wheels to be much noisier, reminding me of the old cast metal trucks with brass wheels on steel axles (although many of them wouldn't roll down a 3% grade, even with a push - I have some under some baggage cars). I also see too many of them left unpainted, like some sort of status symbol - look at me, I'm metal! For me, it makes our overly-wide wheel treads all the more obvious, even with the backs and faces painted. If you're operating in the old solid-bearing era, the wheel faces need to be black and dirty, while cars equipped with roller bearings usually have rust-coloured wheel faces, again somewhat dirty. The backs of both types should be rusted and dirty, and that includes the axles.
If you're using scale-width metal wheels, then the change to metal would be worthwhile if you can afford it.
If you have plastic trucks that aren't free-rolling, regardless of the wheel type, a truck tuner can often improve the situation. Train Miniature cars (including Walthers versions) with sprung trucks were notorious in this department).

I've heard the plastic wheels/dirty track arguement before, but I don't buy it. I cleaned my tracked after ballasting or after applying groundcover nearby, but otherwise don't. The trains run without hesitation and I never clean loco wheels either. I do, very occasionally, vacuum the track and structures. The only wheels that I've ever needed to clean were Kadee wheels on cabooses - they probably get more track time than the average car and may be why the track doesn't require cleaning. If I had to clean track on a regular basis, I would be out of the hobby.

Wayne

[sailormatlac]

Thought about 100% of cars on our club layout are equipped with metal wheels, I must admit I was never convinced myself about track cleaning properties. When you have problems with wheels not rolling well, it's habitually related to the truck itself. From experience, I've seen the same amount of dirt on plastic and metal wheels under similar operation conditions. It must be some argument to sell more wheels.

I personnally like metal wheels for visual reason. When they are nicely painted, you only see the bare metal wheel thread which is a nice feature (thought some blackened wheels doesn't give this effect). As for plastic wheels, quality vary greatly from a manufacturers. It's one reason why we converted the cars. If it wasn't a club expense, I wouln't have undergo this costly converting process for economical reasons.

Matt

[Prairie Trains]

I've seen the same amount of dirt on plastic and metal wheels under similar operation conditions. It must be some argument to sell more wheels.

Plastic wheels rolling on metal rail builds up a static charge which attracts lint and fine dust particles. This builds up on the tread of the wheel and eventually is transferred back to the rail to be picked up by the metal wheels. Dirt on plastic wheels is usually hard to see, it often takes removing the wheel set and a metal scraper to peel a ring of dirt off. Metal wheels don't clean the track they just don't build up a static charge that can lift lint off the road bed like plastic does. This is less prevalent on small layouts and small switching layouts as cars don't run far enough or long enough to build up a strong enough static charge.

On our club members layouts we all used Aero-Locomotive Works track cleaner as it was recommended by Digitrax when we all switched to DCC. My track cleaning train consists of a Centerline Products cleaning car, the roller saturated with cleaning fluid and followed by several box cars with cleaning pads underneath. Some with Masonite for scrubbing and some with cotton wiper pads. This train is run as needed. My train room is fully finished including a drop ceiling, is vacuumed regularly and has an air cleaner that runs 24 hours a day 7 days a week. But the rails still need to be cleaned once or twice a year.

[jwb]

Naturally, this is a very subjective area, and different guys have different preferences. I've found that over the past 25 years, my preference has gone to Accurail as often as not, and they have plastic wheels whose rolling properties are mediocre. So replacing with metal does pay dividends, at least on my layout, and as I see things. I do paint the wheel faces on all my metal wheels, except for Kadee. The blackening wears off the Kadee treads in operation, so I don't bother to polish them.

Regarding Kadee axles, it depends on which products and what time of day. The Kadee wheelsets you buy off the rack at the hobby shop have the metal wheels and the axle ends molded as one piece, joined by a plastic center axle piece, so what touches the journal is in fact metal. Kadee RTR freight cars, though, have all-plastic wheels, one reason I don't favor them. Why pay $30 for plastic wheels? And the trucks on the Kadee log car kits often have older style brass axles all the way through the wheels.