A hole in the wall X4 - a liftout bridge (page 12)

[Trucklover]

WOW TN!! Your moving right along with this, i like the idea of having an N and HOn3 on the top (although i would do HO on the bottom and N on the top but thats only because i model HO lol).

Your start on the section with the mine is looking sweet!! I love how this is taking shape, keep up the great work TN!!

[TrainNut]

Well, with some help from MasonJar, I was able to obtain a plan of John Olsens Jerome and Southwestern. I remembered it from when it was published in MR many years ago and it seemed to do all the same things I wanted in about the same space. After staring at the plan for a while, I was able to design something very similar but with my own twist.

   

As before, the mustard colored brown is the extents of the N scale layout below. The layout above will be HOn3. Right now, I'm thinking of modeling the narrow gauge line between Antonito, Chama, Durango and Silverton. Did I mention I'm going to do all that in a space roughly 9'x4' ? I tried my best to keep it from looking like a bowl of spaghetti. Top left, the line will leave the town of Antonito where it runs alongside a standard gauge line for a bit. It will then proceed through the above mentioned towns climbing a 4% grade at one point to finally arrive at Silverton. This layout went through several designs from one oh so very similar to the Jerome and Southwestern to a figure eight design and finally to what you see now. Since I'm not one for point to point operation, I finally decided upon a folded dog bone with reverse loops at each end and a wye turnaround near Antonito. Hmmmm, I guess I'd like to now open the floor to questions and comments.
Oops... afterthought, all radii are 18"+ and all turnouts have been designed as #6's.

Zzzzzzzziiiiiiiinggggggggggg....... kablook.

[Russ Bellinis]

Looks good, Trainnut. Just a couple of questions/comments. Where does that spur go that comes off the mainline near where you noted the Animas River Valley? Does it just end as a hidden track or does it go over and connect to the wye at Cumbree? The other comment is probably something you already noticed, but I think I should mention it just in case. That passing siding just above the "Durango 3"" is an alternate reverse loop and needs to be wired accordingly.

[nachoman]

Wow, those are some ambitious plans!

A few comments on your proposed HOn3 track plan: First, I always try to avoid having inaccessible turnouts. The one leg of your cumbres wye would be difficult to reach for maintenance and derailments. It is inevitable that sometime you will drive the train against a switch facing the wrong way, and cause a derailment. When that happens, that means you will be reaching under the layout to the most inaccessible point, and complicated if there is an n-scale layout underneath.

Second, your overall plan philosophy works well at keeping things from looking too congested. Be warned, though, that keeping things un-congested-looking on a layout that small usually means exaggerated topography. In other words, there will be a relatively steep escarpment between Cumbres and windy point, and the track going under the bridge and into the tunnel in the animas river valley may look a little strange, especially since you will see the durango yard right atop the tunnel portal.

Of course, I think exaggerated topography is a good thing, because if we built everything to scale with accurate mountain slope angles of 20-25 degrees, our layouts would be pretty flat and boring. I am facing similar issues on my own layout, where very steep escarpments will separate various levels of track. The steep cliffs will be quite interesting, but locating tunnel entrances in such a place they look natural will be a challenge.

[TrainNut]

Where does that spur go that comes off the mainline near where you noted the Animas River Valley? Does it just end as a hidden track or does it go over and connect to the wye at Cumbree? That passing siding just above the "Durango 3"" is an alternate reverse loop and needs to be wired accordingly.

First, I always try to avoid having inaccessible turnouts. Second, ...exaggerated topography. In other words, there will be a relatively steep escarpment between Cumbres and windy point, and the track going under the bridge and into the tunnel in the animas river valley may look a little strange, especially since you will see the durango yard right atop the tunnel portal.

Thanks guys for the feedback. I've thought about your comments and made a few minor changes to reflect.
Russ, the spur should be easier to follow now, but yes, just as you suspected, it connects to the wye. As far as reverse loops, I've changed the color of the two sections I thought would need to be wired as reverse loops to red. Let me know if I have figured this out wrong. My only concern there, is the section of the wye that will be the reverse loop, turns out to only be 1'9" long. They always say to make your reverse loops just a tad longer than your longest train. This does not allow me to have a very long train. Thinkin' on that one. I also want to wire up the switches at the entrances of the reverse loops to be automatic.
Kevin, I addressed the inaccessible turnout issue by sliding the whole upper level to the right by 3 inches. That section will still be hidden but at least now, I can make some removeable scenery to go above it for ease of access. In that area, I'll only be looking at a height difference of 3". I don't think the escarpment will be that bad. Cumbres pass used to be covered with snowsheds and I'm thinking where that one section of the wye dives into a tunnel, I'll cover that entrance up with a snowshed. As far as the tunnel disappearing below the Durango yard, hmmmm, I think we'll just call that a modeling liberty that can't be helped.

   

[Russ Bellinis]

With regard to Dr Wayne's question about access to the back of the wye, is the layout against a corner wall, or do you have room to walk behind it? If there is a "maintenance aisle" behind the layout, even if it isn't as wide as an "operator's aisle", derailments at the wye would not be a problem. I don't think having the reverse loop shorter than your train will pose a problem as long as you don't use interior lighting on the cars or some sort of detectors on the wheels. I think that technically a reverse loop just needs to be shorter than your longest locomotive or locomotive consist. I'm not sure if you will get a short circuit at the 2 switches that could be used to revers the direction of the train at the loop however. If you are running dcc, you could put the gaps in and automatic reverse loop detectors/reversers on the switch that forms the main loop and also on the last switch coming out of the siding.

[TrainNut]

The big thick black lines are walls. the layout will be up against the wall to the left. I can not pull that away from that wall as I have taken every square inch I can already. I will be able to stick my arm in there where the little guy is at now and also from the bottom side which faces our family room so I don't think access will be a huge problem... at least not now after I took Kevins advice and moved the loop to the right by three inches. As far as wiring the switches into the reverse loops to be automatic, that'l be a learning curve for me. We've got a situation like that out at the club and so I hope to borrow on that when the time comes.

[BR60103]

Both reverse loops could be extended quite a bit.
The lower loop could start where it does at Cumbres and go all the way to Animas River Valley.
The upper loop could start in both sidings at Durango and run around almost to the other sidings, possibly including the branch to Silverton.
(Note to self: must check if it's DC or DCC).

[TrainNut]

Hmmm, interesting thoughts...
DCC

[TrainNut]

Since I finished exploring the HOn3 distraction, I decided to go back and work on the N scale part of the plan a bit more. This time, I chose to look at the living room piece and see what I could do to enhance it. Since the piece in the living room was kind of a little layout all on it's own, I thought it would be neat to have a small train that could run just on that section instead of having to wait for the mainline trains to come around every so often. Following is what I came up with...



The magenta lines are meant to denote a very short branchline running in the mountains above the town. It will be 3" above the rest and will have a minimum of 8" radius curves... pretty tight but no problem for a short diesel, steam or a trolley.

In the valley below, I only have two industries. The first will be a lumber company reached by backing a single lumber car off the mainline, across the corner of a parking lot and right down the middle of mainstreet before coming to a stop in the lumber yard. The lumber yard was an inspiration from one that used to exist in my hometown before the railroad got ripped out. The other industry is not really an industry but rather a simple loading/unloading dock on the north side of the tracks, inspired by the good Doctor Wayne. I might elevate the street on the right side to cross the magenta tracks and let the town spill over into the foothills instead of having the road disappear into a tunnel below. I'm not totally thrilled about the way the switch locations turned out on the mainline but my options were kind of limited and I chose to go with what I think will be the easier route.

[Jesso]

I like it! I can't wait to see it. How are you coming on the little section that you started?

[TrainNut]

Right now, I've been spending most of my spare time (what little I seem to have anymore) finessing the trackplans. I have done a little work on the small module I started, but nothing really significant to share... a little plaster work here and there. Thanks for asking.

[TrainNut]

So I still wasn't happy with the plan I'd come up with for the southern half. I did not like the spaghetti mess, the tunnel along the back edge of the layout and several other things. I came up with this...

   

The industry along the top of the bottom half will be a quarry or a gravel pit or something along those lines. The town only has one industry for now but might get another at a later time. Now the tunnel is along the front edge of the layout where I can reach it. I plan to model the tunnel so you can see detail and also, there will be platforms and a subway station of sorts in this area...

   

[Trucklover]

Nice Revisions TN

I really like the how the bottom 2 mainline tracks on the lower half split apart to cross the river and then come back together, that should make a beautiful little scene!!

[Herc Driver]

Wow - impressive!

Good work with the computer program that helps draw that all out. A picture really is worth a thousand posts. I wish I would have spent the time/money getting a program that could do that - probably would have saved me hours of wasted track laying time and effort.

Really great plan!