Problem with current on sidings

[RobertInOntario]

I’ve been having a current / short problem with my fairly new DC British N-scale layout. Please see the photo below.

Basically, this 32” wide by 68” long layout consists of an outer and inner loop. On the inner loop, I cannot get any electrical current to flow down the inside siding (top right) where the red arrows end on this photo. So whenever the points at the top right, are switched so that locos should travel down the sidings (indicated by the red arrows) the power completely stops or goes week. It stops and sometimes the red “short out” light lights up on my transformer. Here are a few other points:

— no matter where a train is on the inner loop, the power completely stops (or goes very weak) once I adjust the points to open up this siding
— occasionally, trains will very slowly move closer to the siding but usually they stop completely (and then the red short-out light will come on).
— the odd thing is that — about a week ago -- I was successfully getting power down these sidings so I could run locos in & out from them. Then, for some reason, this stopped a few days ago. (As far as I know, everything is the same on the layout; no changes.)
— FYI, the transformer connectors join the track just in the lower left area, but are just cropped out of this pic.

I’m running out of ideas to solve this and getting frustrated! I can provide more info as needed. Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

Rob

   

[BR60103]

Rob:
First check is down the sidings. Look for bits of metal across the tracks -- pins or something fallen from a loco. Look at the points. There may be little metal bits in under the switch points.
Is this DCC? Take the rolling stock off the sidings. Something wiyh metal wheels may be sitting over a gap.
Now check under the layout and look at the wiring -- something may have been twisted together.
Do your gaps have insulation in them? If not, rails may have shifted.

[RobertInOntario]

Rob:
First check is down the sidings. Look for bits of metal across the tracks -- pins or something fallen from a loco. Look at the points. There may be little metal bits in under the switch points.
Is this DCC? Take the rolling stock off the sidings. Something wiyh metal wheels may be sitting over a gap.
Now check under the layout and look at the wiring -- something may have been twisted together.
Do your gaps have insulation in them? If not, rails may have shifted.

Thanks, David. I think your theory re pins or bits of metal could be the problem. I'll try to take a closer look around that siding, turnout & area leading up to it. BTW, the layout is DC (I haven't gone the DCC route ... yet ... have you? Just curious).

I was also just experimenting with the points and I did discover one curious thing. As soon as the top/outermost blade (of the turnout in the top right) touches the outermost rail of the inner loop, the train running on the inner loop stops. And, as soon as I move this blade a fraction away from the rail (so it's no longer touching) the train starts running again. Does this info shed any light on this problem?

Thanks again,
Rob

[RobertInOntario]

Another thought ... maybe I should just swap out the turnout at the offending siding with a new one? As mentioned, I did have current going successfully down this siding about a week ago, so it did work at some point.

[shortliner]

Rob - I would try disconnecting your current feed and feed with a Pair of wires with alligator clips about where the motor car is - Ie between the turnouts each end of the curve You may have a shorting problem being caused by the loop track on the left lower if you are running DC - also are they live or dead frogs?

[bdw9535]

If your loop comes back onto itself you have a reversing loop. This may help you out.

Bruce

[RobertInOntario]

Thanks for this info, Bruce.

I'm attaching a pic that shows the entire layout. As you can see, there are two simple loops -- no reverse loops, etc. It's basically an inner and outer loop, each with sidings.

Thought it might be helpful to have a photo that shows the entire layout.

Cheers, Rob

   

[BR60103]

Rob: are they Electrofrog or Insulfrog points?

I still use DC -- too many old Hornby Dublo locos that require major surgery for DCC.

[RobertInOntario]

I thought the problem was solved. I just replaced the turnout on the problem siding. At first, it seemed to work well. But, after using it a few times, the short problem returned.

I think I'll stop tinkering soon and sleep on it!

Thanks again,

Rob

[MasonJar]

Hi Rob,

I'm not sure, but I think I read that you're only feeding power to the track in one spot? If that's the case, is your rail all soldered or are you relying on track joiners to feed the power around the layout? The way you describe how it's fine right after its fixed, but then slowly gets worse, makes me think that something is working its way loose. You might add some additional track feeders and see how that goes.

Andrew

[RobertInOntario]

Hi Rob,
I'm not sure, but I think I read that you're only feeding power to the track in one spot? If that's the case, is your rail all soldered or are you relying on track joiners to feed the power around the layout? The way you describe how it's fine right after its fixed, but then slowly gets worse, makes me think that something is working its way loose. You might add some additional track feeders and see how that goes.
Andrew

Thanks, Andrew. I'll try that or at least experiment by putting extra wires feeds on the track. However, I'm still thinking that there is a short appearing somehow, mainly b/c the short light lights up on the transformer. The track is soldered in a few places but not continuously along the track.

On a different topic my wife & I had to visit the Connaught Cadet Training Centre in Nepean this summer (to pick up our son from cadets training camp). En route, we managed to visit the railway museum at Smith's Falls -- it's quite a nice museum. I'd like to visit on one of their running days.

Cheers, Rob

[Charlie B]

Robert, Make sure the frog on the switch is insulated.
Charlie

[MasonJar]

Hi Rob,
I'm not sure, but I think I read that you're only feeding power to the track in one spot? If that's the case, is your rail all soldered or are you relying on track joiners to feed the power around the layout? The way you describe how it's fine right after its fixed, but then slowly gets worse, makes me think that something is working its way loose. You might add some additional track feeders and see how that goes.
Andrew

Thanks, Andrew. I'll try that or at least experiment by putting extra wires feeds on the track. However, I'm still thinking that there is a short appearing somehow, mainly b/c the short light lights up on the transformer. The track is soldered in a few places but not continuously along the track.

On a different topic my wife & I had to visit the Connaught Cadet Training Centre in Nepean this summer (to pick up our son from cadets training camp). En route, we managed to visit the railway museum at Smith's Falls -- it's quite a nice museum. I'd like to visit on one of their running days.

Cheers, Rob

Whatever is going on, I hope you manage to fix it!

I haven't been to Smiths Falls in a few years, but they do have a decent collection, as well as resources/archives. I don't know if you've ever stopped in Brighton at Memory Junction, but that is worth a few hours as well.

Cheers!

[RobertInOntario]

Thanks, Andrew. I've heard of Memory Junction and will have to add it to my list.

Cheers, Rob

[RobertInOntario]

I'm wondering now if the turnouts I'm using are the insulfrog (not electrofrong) versions -- if so, that could cause the problem? :oops: :oops: :|

Rob