What do you think of this 3x6 track plan?

[RobertInOntario]

It's actually 6' long by 3'-2" wide. Also, it's not really to scale but I've tried to be as accurate as I can -- the shape of the two sidings is not that accurate but you should get the idea. I already have a 3x4 layout that I think I could expand into this layout. The inner loop should be ideal for my small British tank engines and 4-wheel freight cars. Only 2-3 of my locos can't cope with the outside 15R curves.

Please let me know your thoughts on this -- I'm trying to make a very compact HO layout as a "side project".

Thanks in advance. I might add a few more details/comments here later.

Rob

   

[MountainMan]

No offense, Robert:

Functionally, it looks quite servicable, but not very exciting. Can you vary the curves and spurlines a little to add visual interest, or will your scenery and topography do that for you?

[RobertInOntario]

No offense, Robert:

Functionally, it looks quite servicable, but not very exciting. Can you vary the curves and spurlines a little to add visual interest, or will your scenery and topography do that for you?

Yes, I could see that being a problem (no offense taken!). I was hoping that the inner loop would add some interest ... but once the freight train leaves the inner loop there is nowhere to park the passenger train (that I'd be running on the outer loop because there is no passing siding.

Here are some pix (including an overview shot) of how the layout more or less currently looks. Actually, I've done a lot more scenery on one side of the layout but the track plan is currently still the same.

Does this look any better, i.e. should I stay with this plan instead?

Thanks,
Rob
   
   

[nomad]

Hello Robert.
I think there is possibilities with the inner loop. But, I would put away the big passenger stuff. It makes the layout look smaller. The inner circle could be a downtown trolley ( did the British have anything like that ? ) that would be scheduled to go out on the main once in a while. That is when the freight train on the outer loop would have to go into one of the spurs to get out of the way. Kind of add a little extra operation.

Loren

[MasonJar]

Robert,

I think it's only possible to determine the suitability of the layout if there are some goals attached... Technically so far, there's only the space requirement (3x6), so it is successful on that point. But operationally, as noted it's not all that exciting.

Perhaps you would like to think about the givens'n'druthers form, or something else that will help you determine what you want out of the layout. Is it for learning landscaping, watching trains run continuously, should there be an operations scheme (maybe including paperwork?), etc, etc.

If you haven't yet, you might want to Google Carl Arendt for his small/micro layout website. Very interesting stuff, and lots of ways to work operations into even the smallest layout.

Andrew

[RobertInOntario]

Robert,

I think it's only possible to determine the suitability of the layout if there are some goals attached... Technically so far, there's only the space requirement (3x6), so it is successful on that point. But operationally, as noted it's not all that exciting.

Perhaps you would like to think about the givens'n'druthers form, or something else that will help you determine what you want out of the layout. Is it for learning landscaping, watching trains run continuously, should there be an operations scheme (maybe including paperwork?), etc, etc.

If you haven't yet, you might want to Google Carl Arendt for his small/micro layout website. Very interesting stuff, and lots of ways to work operations into even the smallest layout.

Andrew

Thanks, Andrew! Good points. But I'm not sure what givens'n'druthers is. I have checked Carl Arendt's layouts online before (a few months ago) and there are some good options there. I'll check that website again. Part of my "problem" is that I've already started adding scenery to one side of this 4x3 layout, but not to the extent that I could change or expand the other end of it. Thanks again, Rob

[MasonJar]

Rob,

You can find the givens'n'druthers form here: <!-- l --><a class="postlink-local" href="http://www.the-gauge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=468">viewtopic.php?f=46&t=468</a><!-- l -->

There are some other considerations that are not explicitly stated in it though - I've touched a bit on them above - about learning, details of operations and so on.

Andrew

[RobertInOntario]

Rob,

You can find the givens'n'druthers form here: <!-- l --><a class="postlink-local" href="http://www.the-gauge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=468">viewtopic.php?f=46&t=468</a><!-- l -->

There are some other considerations that are not explicitly stated in it though - I've touched a bit on them above - about learning, details of operations and so on.

Andrew

Thanks, Andrew. This helpful. I should have a week in June where I will have lots of evenings to work on the small layout.

Meanwhile, I've managed to get my "larger" 4x6 layout working really well -- but I could even use the G&D info to fine-tune that one.

Cheers,
Rob

[ocalicreek]

Ditto to the Givens & Druthers form.

I would add the idea that there is a sequence of trains to run, or some operational goal. Let the trains tell the story. If their storyline is a bit dull, then let the scenery tell the story. Mini-scenes can also add great interest to small layouts, but for really small (as in micro-layouts) you really may only get one such story or theme on there. You could include several smaller scenes within a larger story 'arc' to give your layout a distinct flavor or character.

Here's an idea. Make a stub-end siding that runs behind a barrier on one of the short ends of the layout. The barrier doesn't have to be a wall of sky backdrop, it can be a hill or a factory, something to hide the train from your normal viewing angles. Let this be your staging to move equipment on and off the layout. Put a siding on the inner loop and arrange it so that your shunting engine will need to travel the greatest distance around the layout from the staging siding all the way to the delivery point before making the setout. Even better if it has to stop, run around the train (just make a trip around the loop to get on the other end...no runaround siding necessary) and then proceed, shoving or pulling as necessary to place the cars.

Put two tracks behind the barrier and keep a short passenger train back there. Run it like a typical branchline push-pull operation for commuters, with the train making regular appearances. This varies the operating and doesn't have to be difficult.

Galen

[RobertInOntario]

Ditto to the Givens & Druthers form.

I would add the idea that there is a sequence of trains to run, or some operational goal. Let the trains tell the story. If their storyline is a bit dull, then let the scenery tell the story. Mini-scenes can also add great interest to small layouts, but for really small (as in micro-layouts) you really may only get one such story or theme on there. You could include several smaller scenes within a larger story 'arc' to give your layout a distinct flavor or character.

Here's an idea. Make a stub-end siding that runs behind a barrier on one of the short ends of the layout. The barrier doesn't have to be a wall of sky backdrop, it can be a hill or a factory, something to hide the train from your normal viewing angles. Let this be your staging to move equipment on and off the layout. Put a siding on the inner loop and arrange it so that your shunting engine will need to travel the greatest distance around the layout from the staging siding all the way to the delivery point before making the setout. Even better if it has to stop, run around the train (just make a trip around the loop to get on the other end...no runaround siding necessary) and then proceed, shoving or pulling as necessary to place the cars.

Put two tracks behind the barrier and keep a short passenger train back there. Run it like a typical branchline push-pull operation for commuters, with the train making regular appearances. This varies the operating and doesn't have to be difficult.

Galen

Thanks, Galen and Andrew. This is making sense and helping me, even giving me some additional ideas (or purposes) for operating my larger layout as well. Cheers, Rob

[ocalicreek]

Rob,

I brought my sketching stuff up to the cabin with me, and since Loren's plan is already well developed (even under construction! ) I will devote a little time this evening to your quandry. Not sure if I'll be able to scan and post it from up here, but at the latest that would be sometime Thursday AM before I could get to my scanner at home.

Any ideas from your Givens and Druthers would help greatly in planning.

Galen

[RobertInOntario]

Rob,

I brought my sketching stuff up to the cabin with me, and since Loren's plan is already well developed (even under construction! ) I will devote a little time this evening to your quandry. Not sure if I'll be able to scan and post it from up here, but at the latest that would be sometime Thursday AM before I could get to my scanner at home.

Any ideas from your Givens and Druthers would help greatly in planning.

Galen

OK, thanks Galen! I'll give the G&D some more thought as well. I can say, in general, that I prefer running passenger trains moreso than freight. Thanks, Rob

[ocalicreek]

Rob,

My inital sketching and figuring was hopefully productive. Seems on a 38"x72" base you can get a loop of 18" radius around the outside with some 15" radius working inside.

Could be as simple as two loops with a crossover and some sidings in the middle. Twist the inner loop and you've got a figure 8 within a loop. This makes two-train operation interesting, as they will be running the same direction part of the way, and opposite directions the other way, as the inner train goes around the figure 8.

Perhaps more interesting would be to keep the outer loop simple, with an inner branch line. The added length that allows for the figure 8, also means you can make an 'S' in the middle up a grade (about 3.5%-4%) with a small switchback across the middle, and a siding or two down below.

I'll doodle some options and post them hopefully Wed. night or Thursday morning. Is there a height restriction to consider?

Galen

[RobertInOntario]

Rob,

My inital sketching and figuring was hopefully productive. Seems on a 38"x72" base you can get a loop of 18" radius around the outside with some 15" radius working inside.

Could be as simple as two loops with a crossover and some sidings in the middle. Twist the inner loop and you've got a figure 8 within a loop. This makes two-train operation interesting, as they will be running the same direction part of the way, and opposite directions the other way, as the inner train goes around the figure 8.

Perhaps more interesting would be to keep the outer loop simple, with an inner branch line. The added length that allows for the figure 8, also means you can make an 'S' in the middle up a grade (about 3.5%-4%) with a small switchback across the middle, and a siding or two down below.

I'll doodle some options and post them hopefully Wed. night or Thursday morning. Is there a height restriction to consider?

Galen

Thanks, Galen -- I appreciate this! I've only just skimmed this but will look at it again later this evening. I like the idea of having the two loops. Thanks again, Rob

[RobertInOntario]

Rob,

My inital sketching and figuring was hopefully productive. Seems on a 38"x72" base you can get a loop of 18" radius around the outside with some 15" radius working inside.

Could be as simple as two loops with a crossover and some sidings in the middle. Twist the inner loop and you've got a figure 8 within a loop. This makes two-train operation interesting, as they will be running the same direction part of the way, and opposite directions the other way, as the inner train goes around the figure 8.

Perhaps more interesting would be to keep the outer loop simple, with an inner branch line. The added length that allows for the figure 8, also means you can make an 'S' in the middle up a grade (about 3.5%-4%) with a small switchback across the middle, and a siding or two down below.

I'll doodle some options and post them hopefully Wed. night or Thursday morning. Is there a height restriction to consider?

Galen

Thanks, again Galen. I like the idea of two loops (one inside the other). I also like the figure-8 idea as well as that could be a creative addition. I'm looking forward to see what you come up with! I think they layout could be interesting operating one passenger train and one passenger train. Cheers, Rob