DC/DCC

[doctorwayne]

No joke about the decoder installations, Les. (By the way, in Canada we can also vote for whom we like. Unfortunately, like in America, there's not an awful lot of acceptable choices - mine is often "None of the above". I'm not sure if you're offered the opportunity to refuse your ballot in the U.S., though.)

Anyway, to the issue of decoders (I don't want to sidetrack this thread, though) - I've run into some problems. The locomotives run great, but I don't fully understand the "how-to" of setting CVs - where to make the adjustments for starters. There doesn't appear to be any adjustment on the decoders themselves and I'm not sure where else to look. I got these from a friend, supposedly "new", and very cheap, as he said that they're a very basic model with no "bells & whistles" (literally ) and that most folks would want something with more features (exactly what I wanted, though). I didn't get any instructions with them but he showed me how to do one, and assured me that installation would be "a snap" (which it was, and no sign either of that "magic smoke" to which I've seen references). He's gone on vacation, but I figured someone here can help me out. There aren't any markings on the units, so I don't know the brand. I'll try to get a picture later, although my camera fell off the tripod yesterday and doesn't look too good.

Wayne

[Gary S]

Uh.... er.... ummm..... uh.... DocWayne.... what DCC system did you buy?

[doctorwayne]

Not sure, Gary, there's nothing on the decoders to identify them - I'll try to get a picture later, but I have to go out right now. The locos do run great, but I'm always curious to know more. Do they make decoders that don't allow such adjustments? I wish they would have come with some literature or instructions, though.

Wayne

[Gary S]

You're confusin' me, DocWayne. The decoders, regardless of brand, need an external system to make them work - I'm thinking you are still pulling our legs here.

There doesn't appear to be any adjustment on the decoders themselves

And this makes me think even more that you are kidding us!

[jglfan]

I wait with bated breath to see where this leads.

[tetters]

Hold on... I'll go get the Front End Loader...


..IT'S starting to get pretty deep around here now. hock:

[Charlie B]

I think the decoders Wayne has are made by GERN with 3 percent more BS, and 3%more smoke when you let it out.
Charlie

[Lester Perry]

So Dr Wayne, some seem to think you are messing with us. I believe you though, so here is a chance to show the scoffers. How many wires are on the decoder what colors are they? This will show them.

[Charlie B]

So Dr Wayne, some seem to think you are messing with us. I believe you though, so here is a chance to show the scoffers. How many wires are on the decoder what colors are they? This will show them.

Les, me thinks he could find an image on Google without any problem.

[Lester Perry]

oh, you are right. I still have faith in him. He wouldn't joke about this.

[rrinker]

If these really aren't GERN-infused decoders, get us some info, I'm sure we can get you up and running.

--Randy

[P5se Camelback]

BiL is still wearing his hip waders ... hoping he doesn't need to crawl into a boat!

[Green_Elite_Cab]

You're partially right, I suppose. The layout is a single block, but I can kill sidings if I wish to park a loco somewhere - it's not particularly complicated, though. To put it in the context of DCC, it would've been more work (and expense) for me to run a bus line around the layout to ensure reliable operation were I using DCC. As it is, there's a pair of wires from the power source to the tracks - pretty simple.
I don't need multiple train control - there's only one operator, so there's only one train moving at a time. I spend a lot of time and effort re-building locomotives and rolling stock, and there's absolutely no way that something's going to be running somewhere on the layout when I'm not right there beside it to savour every aspect of it.

Yes, but you're a unique situation. DC works for you, and I'm certainly not trying to convert you. Certainly, having one set of wires makes it simple, but you could do this easily on a small HO layout with DCC. Even so, most DC layouts i know of were block wired, and those blocks pretty much set up the infrastructure to install a DCC system over a large area.

The lights don't dim or brighten with the throttle simply because I don't use operating lights - in my modelling era they weren't illuminated in the daytime, but even if they had been prototypical, I would have removed them - it's simply a feature that doesn't interest me. On second thought, it's a feature that I don't want in my locos - I spent too many years servicing or building locos for people who wanted lights, and I really grew to dislike that aspect of the hobby. They look fine on someone else's locos, but to me, they're a nuisance.

I have to agree there, but thats personal preference. When my Pennsy 2-10-4 blew its headlight at a train show, EVERYONE seemed concerned with either having me try to turn it on or fix it. I'm guessing the majority likes their headlights.

In my case, i have a bunch of commuter cars with a ton of headlights and markers that i haven't figured out yet, so i can see where you're coming from (i'll still light all 18 cars though).

Another aspect of the DC/DCC discussion not mentioned much here (although I have seen a lot of talk about it elsewhere) is track cleaning. From what I've read, trouble-free operation in DCC is very-much influenced by the cleanliness of the track. I have just under 200' of mainline in service, with another 60'-or-so yet to be built. If I had to clean all that track (and probably that much again if staging tracks, passing tracks, and sidings were included) I'd remove the layout - I retired so I wouldn't have to work on stuff I don't enjoy.

I can't imagine any scenario that would compel me to switch to DCC, but I don't have any problem if someone else chooses to do so.

Wayne

Again, not trying to convert you, but still. Track cleaning isn't a big deal. Anyone who take good care of their layout will not have trouble. If it ever gets dirty enough that a DCC signal can't get through, then its dirty enough to have been long neglected. More often then not, its dirty wheels that are the real cause, but even so, thats the responsibility of the modeler to keep clean, and you have to clean them every few months anyway.

For the advantages, DCC is superior (in MOST situations) in terms of flexibility and features.

[Green_Elite_Cab]

I have said elsewhere that DCC didn't really simplify anything, it just moved the wiring from outside the loco to inside the loco. Someone on this thread mentioned 'running the layout'. That's essentially what DC is - DCC is running the train, not the layout. So moving the complexity inside the engine isn't all bad, I guess, from that perspective. I don't like wiring. There's a sense of satisfaction in getting it done and seeing it run, but DC engines provide that satisfaction without any additional work.
Galen

Except that instead of spending hours under a layout wiring something up, only to still have to contend with keeping up with the blocks, You can just plug a decoder in (9 out of 10 times), and then the locomotive will take care of it. the flexibility over a block is where DCC wins.

[Green_Elite_Cab]

No joke about the decoder installations, Les. (By the way, in Canada we can also vote for whom we like. Unfortunately, like in America, there's not an awful lot of acceptable choices - mine is often "None of the above". I'm not sure if you're offered the opportunity to refuse your ballot in the U.S., though.)

Anyway, to the issue of decoders (I don't want to sidetrack this thread, though) - I've run into some problems. The locomotives run great, but I don't fully understand the "how-to" of setting CVs - where to make the adjustments for starters. There doesn't appear to be any adjustment on the decoders themselves and I'm not sure where else to look. I got these from a friend, supposedly "new", and very cheap, as he said that they're a very basic model with no "bells & whistles" (literally ) and that most folks would want something with more features (exactly what I wanted, though). I didn't get any instructions with them but he showed me how to do one, and assured me that installation would be "a snap" (which it was, and no sign either of that "magic smoke" to which I've seen references). He's gone on vacation, but I figured someone here can help me out. There aren't any markings on the units, so I don't know the brand. I'll try to get a picture later, although my camera fell off the tripod yesterday and doesn't look too good.

Wayne

Oh wow, i should really read all the way through a thread (internet died for a week).

You'll need a system to change them, but The basic CVs are

CV1 - the short address (1-127). its usually set to three
CV2 - Start voltage
CV3 - Accleration
CV4 - decceleration
CV5 - maximum voltage (affects speed at highest "Speed step")
CV6 - Mid voltage (Affects speed "mid range speed step")

After those, most things are just extra stuff. 4 digit adressing can be easy depending on the system you're using. I reccomend an NCE Power cab (i think thats the basic set). the NCE system is the most user friendly out of the box. It will actually walk you through what you want to do, and then do all the complicated programming for you (such as long addresses). It even has a recovery feature if you mess up. Its saved a bunch of my decoders.