Introducing The PistonBroke Line

[Steamtrains]

Amazing.....

[OBJack]

Thanks Charlie, Carl and Gus, I appreciate the comments.
Well Folks, it's been a week or so since I put ASCII characters into cyberspace, so here comes the next part of the puzzle.
I have great difficulty in nutting out the electronics from a book,... unless I can just do it and see and see if there are any sparks, if not then proceed to the next step..This was a while back but I still need some direction and advise, so pay attention, as there will be questions .
So.... progress so far:

I purchased a few tortoise switch machines

And some stationary decoders ( The WabbitFBs )

My take on the Wabbits with the feedback capability is that it doesn't matter whether the turnout is thrown by a toggle switch or your cab control/hand piece the system will always be able to tell you which way they are thrown.
And I assumed this was not possible with the basic wabbitt or Hare.


My problem has been ( and still is) that I think I may need another bit of hardware to hook it all up to the power station.

So I have wired up a few tortoise switch machines to the turnouts, and then wired them to the wabbits to give cab control as well as toggle switch control of the turnouts.

A few problems arose 'cause a turnout happened to be directly above a bit of the benchtop structure, but nothing a big hammer an oxy welder a crescent and a bit of wire twitching couldn't fix.

The other problem was that my benchtop with the foam base was to thick and the length of wire (which is supplied with the tortoise) used to throw the turnout was not long enough.

So a bit of piano wire was purchased which I could cut to length. it was also a bit thicker than the original.

Next problem: I didn't have a drill bit long enough or small enough to drill the pilot for the tortoise' wire thru the foam and baseboard:
because all my track has been laid, I needed to drill from the top thru the hole in the turnout bar to get the exact location of where the hole needs to be .

Solution: I used the piano wire as the drill bit. It was obviously small enough to fit thru the the hole in the throw bar of the turnout. Worked a treat, went thru the MDF baseboard quite easily. At last a Score to Jack.

I bought all the wiring out from under the bench and put it on a board / boards screwed to the side, to make working on the wiring so much easier. Hopefully it will be covered by a curtain one day.

And by putting a few cuts in the rail at strategic places and a bit of wire back to the wabbit, you can ensure that if a train is going to enter a turnout which is turned against it, the turnout will automatically switch to the correct alignment to stop a derailment, or short circuit.

And I seem to have been able to wire two turnouts (which create a crossover) together so that they will always be in alignment ie: they both switch together.

Now I will have to put all these accessory decoders onto their own power supply. 'cause I guess if you have a short you wont be able to switch the turnouts. At the moment everything is running of the track bus wires.
The switches on the control panel will be DPDT momentary on - center off switches so that the cab can always switch the points if desired.

Now for da question

I still want to know if an extra bit of hardware is needed between the wabbits and the power station so that the cab/throttle can tell which way the turnout is thrown when you call it up, ( by showing either a + or a - ) 'cause at the moment When I call up the turnout to switch it, I can't tell which way it is set.
I am using a lenz system, And it uses a + or - to show how the point is set, but at the moment if the point is changed by a switch on the control panel then the system doesn't update the change to show on the throttle.

Remember this Lynn? Can you tell by looking at your throttle when you call turnout up to switch it ...which way it is set?

I haven't progressed much.

Next ... The Control Panel

Jack

News Flash
At this point The War Office returned from work and said that the Principal of the local school would like to bring 20 kids to view the Pistonbroke line for a school assignment on perspective.

Must scurry off and tidy up the Layout and pack away some junk before the pack arrive .

[MountainMan]

I don't know which is better - the layout itself or the narrative about it's genesis!

[OBJack]

Whoops!!
missed my deadline.
I started 6 months ago, pondering the next steps on my layout, and need some advice from the experts.

Well two things really
# 1. What sort of signaling system is usually used on layouts, what I mean is:
Do you wire the signal up so the red and green aspects of the signal represent the way the turnout is positioned like traffic lights ie, clear or thrown,
...or is it wired to show a clear or occupied block ahead....

Or can you set it up to show either /or or both.
And I guess that's when you go to the next stage, with detectors in the rails, so the train to stops on any red signal?

And I will want bi-polar (is that the word for a two colour LED ) LEDs on the main control panel for indications of open or closed routes.

#2. I guess that creates the next problem: A control Panel
What type of construction and a "how to build" would be a great starting point for me, so if anyone has any ideas or websites that they know of feel free...
I know I have not finished other areas of the Pistonbroke line, but feel the need to confuse myself with other imponderables.

Someone out there has signals and control panels installed, so don't be shy, tell me how you have done it.

Maybe I should split this into two separate posts?


I decided to strike out on my own, and I tried my hand at constructing a control panel.

The objective being, to build an experimental panel and see what problems came, then maybe build the real one with the bugs fixed.

And again, if anyone can shed some light on the issue, or internet sites they know of, on control panels they would like to part with ... please let me know.

I searched the internet and with my limited knowledge of things electrical, I could not find any sites where anyone who has built a control panel, has given instructions on how to achieve it .

So I am flying blind here..............yep nothin's changed.

Anywho, ......first off I bought a sheet of polycarbonate, and reading things on the internet it seemed like I was going to have lots of trouble cutting it to size without it any splitting, cracking, or even exploding once the saw hit it.

Maybe it was different stuff from what I bought

but I had no trouble and cut it with this band saw, and a jigsaw, And it drilled easy enough

It has the plastic on to stop scratching which happens very easily.

Next I went to the computer and tried to draw and print a graphic of the lines for the board

This is the half baked result

Now question one: How do I print out a design that is bigger than a sheet of paper without a join showing?
Is that a printer issue? Or do I have to maybe paint a schematic on something else if I want to make it bigger?

I have finished the prototype..... but still need a few more clues on how to best make a panel
More on the blundering construction later...

Jack
(of clubs)

[Tom]

Hey Jack, on that control panel question, here's how *I* would do it:

I would take a piece of that plexiglass you have there, and using thin tape, mask off your track schematic in reverse on the back side of your plexi, then paint the pack side of the plexi the dark blue. If you REALLY want to get trick, make that "Piston Broke Line" name on a decal and apply that (a reverse decal) before you paint the back side of the panel. That way, when you flip it over, it is nice and smooth, glossy, and will look sharp (once you remove the tape after the paint is dry). Then I would enclose it in a wood framed box with lighting behind it.

That is just how I dould do it.

[Will_Annand]

Jack, you and your team are doing a great job on that layout.

Things are looking real good.

[OBJack]

Thanks Will, you are too kind.
And Tom,Thanks for your input. I have not been able to find the thin tape you talk about. I remember Someone somewhere said it was car pinstripping tape, would this be the case? I will keep looking and have a go at it soon as I need to add a few more hares to a few more turnouts so a new switchboard is in the offing.

This is how the prototype came into being

I know I usually complicate matters more than necessary, as I have stationary decoders ( Hares) driving the tortoise motors that switch the turnouts

Each Hare controls two tortoise switch motors

but it makes it easier to use LEDs (ie no resistors needed) in the control panel, as the power comes from the Hare decoder which I guess must be low voltage.

After cutting the polycarbonate to the same size as the graphic, the next step in the control panel was to drill holes for the switches and LEDs.
I clamped the printout between the polycarbonate and a backing board then marked and drilled the holes, I used a smaller drill bit first off, then with the correct bit enlarged the holes.

The resultant poly look

The plastic remains on, and a minor problem ( besides not being able to cut a straight line) was the drill made a bit of a mess of some holes in the paper as it passed thru.

Then the switches and LEDs were put in place

Switches #6 & #7 each control the turnouts above and below them, So that the turnouts are always aligned.
The switches I have used are DPDT momentary on- centre off switches, which means the switches return to the centre off position, and so that enables the turnout to be controlled by the cab/throttle once again.
IE: if the switch remains on then the turnout cannot be operated from the throttle.( Switch overrides the throttle)
The LEDs are bipolar 3mm.
The silver 5mm blue LEDs are to be used if I can get a train detection system running.

Then I started burning my fingers with the soldering

I still don't know how to hold the wire steady enough for long enough to make a nice neat connection,.... a clothes peg? To big?

More wires & nearly there

The white blue and yellow wires go from the switch, back to the Hare decoder which controls the turnout
The green wires are connected to the LEDs, and go out to terminals on the respective Hare decoders.

We hooked it up and there was no resultant Bang or burning smell

So this is the result

A veritable XMAS tree of lights, doesn't mean to say we can understand what is happening on the RR.
Another problem was ........because there are two or three LEDs hooked up in parallel at each turnout so each switch position could be seen, one LED will be red while the other is green, it seems to me that the red always shines brighter and it seems the current may be taking the path of least resistance, ie the red may have a lower voltage requirement than the green? Anyone?
I'm not sure weather they are the right terms or not, can someone enlighten me?... And a Fix?

NB. The bright green LEDs are hooked up in series straight into my accessory Bus of 16v AC, they are just green LEDs and are at the throat of the turnout so they will always be green and all the same colour. There are 5 of them so each will be getting about 3v, so no resistors needed. And that's a bonus. :rock:

Everything is working as it should, (except for the dull green lights) and that is where I left things, and I'm sure the experimentation will continue while I try to find some answers.
Looks like the next stop is to find some pin striping tape huh?

Jack

[LiveSteamer]

Nice Jack.

[tetters]

I'm pretty sure that when I was fooling around with my V.O.M. meter I noticed that the red LED's I have had a lower resistance value. Didn't seem like much, however I guess it does make a difference. :|

When I constructed my switch panels made out of a simple piece of 1/4" MDF board I found that trimming the leads on the LED's a bit and using a pair of small pliers to hold the wire made a world of difference in keeping things steady while soldering instead of trying to use my bare fingers.

Best advice I ever received (and this goes for just about anything you are going to solder together) was to PRE-TIN the leads on the LED's and the wire connections. Then just a few sec's with a hot tip and bammo, connection soldered.

BTW - if you trim the leads on the LED's so that they are not so long use a small metal clamp as a heat sink. If the LED gets too hot from soldering it will get burned out. I lost a couple that way. Plus remember, the flat edge on the led bulb itself is where the (neg) - polarity lead is...usually... the lead closest to the round edge is the + polarity one. OR Just always keep the + one a little longer then the - one.





BTW - Your panel looks great!

[OBJack]

Thanks for the info Tetters, it seems the more skin you burn off the quicker you learn.
And the panel you showed there, does the red led indicate the turnout is thrown and a green led indicate a thru route? or something completely different?
I think you are right about the lower resistance, since then I have also read different colours have different resistant values.
maybe back to the drawing board, and a whole new system.

Hey Jack, on that control panel question, here's how *I* would do it:
I would take a piece of that plexiglass you have there, and using thin tape, mask off your track schematic in reverse on the back side of your plexi, then paint the pack side of the plexi the dark blue. If you REALLY want to get trick, make that "Piston Broke Line" name on a decal and apply that (a reverse decal) before you paint the back side of the panel. That way, when you flip it over, it is nice and smooth, glossy, and will look sharp (once you remove the tape after the paint is dry). Then I would enclose it in a wood framed box with lighting behind it.
That is just how I dould do it.

Tom, thanks for the idea, I will take up the challenge and give your idea a crack on the next board, which I want to be bigger than the A4 paper of my last attempt.

Now....

A while back I needed to start building a few kits to enliven the layout.

As Laser cut kits are not a readily available item in our LHs here, (and I am to much of a novice to bash, or even kitbash a build) I was lucky enough when the Aussie dollar was near parity with the US dollar, to place an order for some kits from the US.
Here is one of my first attempts

O'Larys garage, it says, a kit by JL Innovative Design.

I thought it looked like a fairly typical 1950s type garage world wide.

So emptied the Box, and these are the goodies inside

Ooohhh I see they have snuck some of those dreadful instruction sheets inside too.

and a few castings

My first attempt at weathering went like this...

First an A/I wash

Then....... I have heard about this technique of applying rubber cement or something to the surface before painting then rubbing it off afterward to give a peeling paint effect

So lets give it a shot

I have painted some of this rubber/latex product onto the panels.......

Stop the laughing already..... its all I had that sounded like what the big boys were using, ....and it was tax free.

Then some Reefer white paint

The Result after rub

And

I think I will give it another wash of A/I or paint and see where we go from there. OK enough crappola for now, gotta get back to the sweatshop .....er that's O'Larys Garage.

So I repainted with a light white wash again & also another A/I wash to tone things down

... this is the result...

After painting the windows and doors red, I then experimented with the signs, and as you can see back in in the first few photos there are lots of them.
The first thing I did was photocopy the sheet so I had a few to play with, and started sticking a few to the walls and windows

With mixed results

The big sign at the bottom is of course the large one that sits atop the main building, and I have tried to age it in keeping with the rest of the building.
I have only just finished applying a wash to it and it is not stuck down to the board so it looks a bit wet and wavy at the moment ......
Maybe have a look tomorrow and see, or most likely leave it 'till the end and then decide, and I can always paste another over it

Some closeups for the gory details and mistakes

And

And

Went and found some glue and hooked a few walls together, ..
left them for a few days and came back and they had not fallen apart, So with that sort of luck on my side I decided to press on, gluing and tacking madly

Until I had a resemblance to the pictures on the cover of the box

Or so I thought

And

Then I started fiddling around with all the little tiny detail bits, and with my big fat fingers at their best working with objects over 1 ft long and about 2kgs in weight I started down struggle street.

I can now see, how ordinary adults, can all of a sudden breakdown cry ....... Just put in a few hours working with fiddly bits that you cant see or hold.

Anywho a couple of pics of the near enough finished Garage

And

And

And

And

Then I went to find somewhere on the RR to plant a garage,

Found a place at last, post a pic later


Jack

[OBJack]

It has sat at the end of the street for awhile, so until another change of mind

Jack

[upnick]

Hi Jack,


Must admit i'm ashamed to say i missed your layout progress on here ...... what can i say sure you have done this before or have a natural talent for it, the rock colours look great well shaded and blended in with the greenery

I do like the overall plan of the layout nice continious running for the anklebiters to see, running different types of stock gives you a varied theme i especially like the Blueline loco

Cant wait to see more progress on the line the war office permitting of course :hey:

[Ralph]

Wow! The garage and truck service is fantastic! I love all of the signs. It has just the right look! I'm also very impressed with the control panel and all of the lights. Very slick and professional looking!

Ralph

[OBJack]

Thanks for taking time to read the posts Nick and Ralph, You will send an old man into raptures with those sorts of comments, :oops: but keep them coming.... and I'll double your pay.

A new building came to The PistonBroke Line in September last year.
I got a quote from Rusty Stumps to see if could afford to build one of his structures for some accommodation for the LPBs working on the Line.
After discussions with the War Office, Rusty agreed to a 25 year term for payment, .. . so I rang the builders, and soon.....

....Material started to arrive

I don't reckon the builders are quite up to doing it justice, but with the so many out of work I thought I would give them a job and some experience, and who knows maybe one day they will be master builders like many others on this forum.

Now excuse me while I find the War Office so she can start cracking her whip ..... :hey:

Well finally the builders came ....... there were other things to do they said...

However onwards and upwards
Two pieces the same..? WTF

The kit has a base (or subwall) wall with a cardstock? timber "face" wall which has a sticky backing to glue the two together

So..?

Being a little confused at first, I had to resort to reading the manual.
The manual said it was an easy first step, ....for each wall tear off the protective backing on the "face" wall and stick the two parts toge

The face wall is fairly thick as can be seen from these (not so flash) photos from the manual explaining how they go together

And

just .......make sure they are lined up exactly before they touch and stick, or apparently .......yep they stay stuck all crooked

First attempt

Looks like we had a win.

Then a few more walls and still no mishap

Time for a lottery ticket,

So once stuck together I started to paint the walls, and put a few doors and window sills in.

And even some glass

Just a bit of weathering.........I don't think I want the structure to be too weathered, otherwise the PistonBroke line could look a bit more rundown than it really is.

Whoops hock: there seems to have been a paint malfunction on the middle of that back wall , better get the painters back.
It should be under warranty though.
You just cant seem to trust anyone to do a good job these days. :mrgreen:

Back shortly with a different crew, gotta spread the work around.


Jack

[Trucklover]

WOW Jack!! Beautiful work on those wood structures!! The weathering and the signage on the truck garage looks sweet!!