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My other, door-sized thread has sorta died, but I'm going to take up a portion of the garage in my new space ad plan to set up a L-shape on a pair of hollow core doors either 30x80 to 36x80, so I'll have betwen an 80x110 and an 80x116 space.
we don't close on the house until December, so It;ll be a bit.
Givens remain the same as before: long mainline run, big mountain w/ tunnels made from foam, with possibly a newspaper and plaster peak. I'm thinking of taking the basics of my inglenook and industrial switch zone layout, and unfolding it to make a branch/short line off the mains
When I hear the iron horse make the hills echo with his snort like thunder, shaking the earth with his feet, and breathing fire and smoke from his nostrils, it seems as if the earth had got a race now worthy to inhabit it.
-- Henry David Thoreau
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Here are two designs:
![[Image: RR2MQUf.png]](http://i.imgur.com/RR2MQUf.png)
or
![[Image: JnJEWwu.jpg]](http://i.imgur.com/JnJEWwu.jpg)
the first one still needs sidings added, passenger, yard, industry, and passing sidings
When I hear the iron horse make the hills echo with his snort like thunder, shaking the earth with his feet, and breathing fire and smoke from his nostrils, it seems as if the earth had got a race now worthy to inhabit it.
-- Henry David Thoreau
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Depending on the landscape and industries, I like the first one. I can visualize some great railroading and scenicking. 
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To be honest, neither design looks necessarily promising in my opinion.
The first one is good in that its nice and open, but that Green region is a mess. The first major problem is that your yard is WAY too small, and it won't really be useful for any kind of switching or operations. A yard in which 50% of the tracks are occupied is considered full. Estimating from the lengths of your industrial spurs, you've got way more industrial capacity than yard capacity. This will almost certainly result in frustrated operations to say the least.
Instead, You should really plan out what sort of industries you want, how many cars and of what type they are, and how much space all those cars will take up. Then build your yard accordingly.
The second one is a little cramped. There would not be any room for any kind of meaningful scenery between all those tracks. Less is potentially more in the end. I would also re-examine the yard and indstrial spur configuration of this plan. There is probably a better way.
Modeling New Jersey Under the Wire 1978-1979.
![[Image: logosmall.png]](http://i543.photobucket.com/albums/gg445/CAB_IV/Model%20Trains%202013/logosmall.png)
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taking your advice I cleaned up the ed of the branch line and moved the inglenook, which is not the only yard (and never was)
![[Image: yOBEEV6.png]](http://i.imgur.com/yOBEEV6.png)
both yards double as passing sidings (there probably needs to be one, maybe two more, but where?) and as passenger stations
When I hear the iron horse make the hills echo with his snort like thunder, shaking the earth with his feet, and breathing fire and smoke from his nostrils, it seems as if the earth had got a race now worthy to inhabit it.
-- Henry David Thoreau
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i don't know what you are interested in model train operations. In my opinon both track plans have way too many tracks and switches. Perhaps you could settle first to a yard, small yard with short trains with just an engine or two and a growing number of cars to serve the Town and its industry. When finished with that you will find a way to expand the railroad within the space you have and maybe add more trains and workable staging. In many layouts everything else are dominated by trains instead of as in reality the surroundings are dominating the trains. I think that Lance Mindheim has come up with something good, with less tracks and shorter consists and using prototype rules you can add more action with much less effort. I guess one of the most smart layouts I have seen is one German modeller, Dieter Thomas, who made a german based N-scale layout years back which included loads on very limited space. lots of scenery a town, and a switchback yard where the second leg was the mainline and the other a short former line now used for switching an industry. All this in space just over 3x4 feet, pretty amazing as everything looked quite convinsing! He even had space under the layout for a small staging yard for the two trains that ran on it.
Even a 50 foot car standing alone is rather samll but afte coupling it up with a few of its sisters, you realize how much space they consume, add a diesel or two and the sight can wreck any great plans you had in the mind in beginning. So I guess one scene, a Town scene will be great from the beginning and you can still expand it, with a loop down to lowel level where you have a staging so you can make the line more busier with more trains and few meets in the Town. I guess you are possible to save money and maintenance and finish the layout before you have a change of hearts later on. Big city yards eats lot of space and make them work better you need switch leads and even more space. Perhaps a switching area in a city or in suburbs works better or a backwoods town. I guess you can start making a list. First what you want to see on the layout most and decent with items you are willing to compromise more with further down the list. This way you can do the most of your future layout and have even more fun with it years to come!
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Just found a few photos on Dieter Thomas small N-scale layout. http://www.kirnbachtaeler.de/modell/karl...uhe02.html
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Quote:i don't know what you are interested in model train operations
I am not interested in careful prototype operations. Prototype operations of sending the same cars to the same industries every operation session is boring to me -- I'll lose interest in it quickly. Add in a time schedule and it feels way too much like work.
What I like are railway shunting puzzles and continuous operations. I work with randomized consists with dice rolls, so operation is different and building trains is mentally challenging.
The branchline is an inglenook siding, where a switcher or GP will build a 5 car train randomly out of 8 cars, and deliver them randomly to the 5 industries at the other end of the branch, a busy industrial park, basically changing my existing 30x54 layout into a point to point. The main yard will be for building long through freights and passenger runs for stress-relief continuous running.
When I hear the iron horse make the hills echo with his snort like thunder, shaking the earth with his feet, and breathing fire and smoke from his nostrils, it seems as if the earth had got a race now worthy to inhabit it.
-- Henry David Thoreau
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I am not interested in careful prototype operations. Prototype operations of sending the same cars to the same industries every operation session is boring to me -- I'll lose interest in it quickly. Add in a time schedule and it feels way too much like work.
---------------------------------
But,that's the glamor of real railroading ~repeating local work with the same type of cars.
For my money watching trains running in mindless loops is boring..In fact during open houses at the club I'm bored to tears after the first few minutes of loop running. :o
That's not surprising though since I like terminal switching and running a local above everything else.
Larry
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Summerset Ry
Make Safety your first thought, Not your last! Safety First!
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Brakie Wrote:Quote:I am not interested in careful prototype operations. Prototype operations of sending the same cars to the same industries every operation session is boring to me -- I'll lose interest in it quickly. Add in a time schedule and it feels way too much like work.
---------------------------------
But,that's the glamor of real railroading ~repeating local work with the same type of cars.
For my money watching trains running in mindless loops is boring..In fact during open houses at the club I'm bored to tears after the first few minutes of loop running. :o
That's not surprising though since I like terminal switching and running a local above everything else.
Difference is Brakie, you got paid for it, it was your actual Job  A Paycheck covers a lot of issues. And I'm sure there were little things just about every day that didn't go according to plan.
I guess I want my pretend railroads to be more of a switching game, while provisioning for continuous running, because watching trains in loops is relaxing. Can alwys use more dopamine hits 
When I hear the iron horse make the hills echo with his snort like thunder, shaking the earth with his feet, and breathing fire and smoke from his nostrils, it seems as if the earth had got a race now worthy to inhabit it.
-- Henry David Thoreau
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looking at the plan itself, I'm wondering about the feasibility of changing the crossover to another bridge, and dragging the blue line to vaguely parallel the branchline at a different, lower grade (around 2%) before curving back to the south east the two different tracks at different levels should look dramatic
When I hear the iron horse make the hills echo with his snort like thunder, shaking the earth with his feet, and breathing fire and smoke from his nostrils, it seems as if the earth had got a race now worthy to inhabit it.
-- Henry David Thoreau
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Difference is Brakie, you got paid for it, it was your actual Job .A Paycheck covers a lot of issues
The pay was the only reason why I braking for a livin' instead of having a normal 40 hour a week job.
I fully agree loop running is relaxing..If I stay at the controls to long during open house at the club I get a bad case of head bobbing. :oops:
Larry
Engineman
Summerset Ry
Make Safety your first thought, Not your last! Safety First!
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new mod:
Got rid of the branchline, scattered the industries about, straightened out the yard, and kept the plan under 20 turnouts. changed the crossing to a bridge, it meanders up and back down with the slow rise for a 2% grade (20 snap track segments up and 20 more back down)
![[Image: eq7zPpi.png]](http://i.imgur.com/eq7zPpi.png)
When I hear the iron horse make the hills echo with his snort like thunder, shaking the earth with his feet, and breathing fire and smoke from his nostrils, it seems as if the earth had got a race now worthy to inhabit it.
-- Henry David Thoreau
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Hello Screwysqrl
It's not clear from the plans whether these layout options are
--in a corner,
--free standing, or
--one edge along a wall.
IF these are planned for placement in a corner, here are my thoughts:
Option 1 places inglenook switching too far away requiring a reach across the layout.
Option 2 seems to offer a good reflection of your interests as I understand them::
--randomized switching puzzle and
--continuous running option.
It places the inglenook area within easy reach
It also offers a yard for organizing inbound and outbound trains.
A lot of physical action (uncoupling, throwing swithes) could occur in the pocket of the "L" shape
Option 4 (revision of option 1) has reduced switching opportunity compared with option 2.
if left side is along the wall, you have 4 switches too far away in case there are derailments there.
-- not that this ever happens in model railroads....
If you want to include the additional swithching duites of moving cars to the layout from the outer world,
option 2 has both the car float and the fake mine/interchange to provide inbound & outbound shipments.
Options 3 & 4 could use the "yard lead" in a dual capacity to represent an interchange track. the adjacent run around track would let you then back the incoming cars into the yard.
Or, you could use an 0-5-0 placement of interchange cars anywhere convenient on the layou, and then move to and from the yard.
Just a thought:
<<I am not interested in careful prototype operations. Prototype operations of sending the same cars to the same industries every operation session is boring to me -- I'll lose interest in it quickly. Add in a time schedule and it feels way too much like work.>>
Not all "operations" is runniing the same cars to the same industries, on a fixed schedule
Here are some info sources I found informative & inspirational when I was planning & forming my layout:
--Track Planning for Realistic Operation (by John Armstrong)
--How to Operate Your Model Railroad (by Bruce Chubb)
--Operation Handbook for Model Railroads (by Paul Mallery)
--Realistic Model Railroad Opertion (by Tony Koester)
This one really inspired me to action, as I was able to put it in effect almost immediately:
Cripple Creek Central (Model Railroader series in the 1990s, now in a book format -- article on randomized car operation on an HO 4x8)
Hope this helps.
--Hillyard
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I'd very seriously start by narrowing down those baseboards - and think about keeping your track (and scenery) clean! Reaching across 3 feet of baseboard to clean track at the back, is a sure-fire recipe for damage to scenery and to reach the top left corner is over a 48" reach - unless you are planning to have a walk-all-the-way-around-it layout? - in which case you are going to need another 30" minimum all the way around. If I was doing the design - I'd be running a shelf, maximum 18" deep, around the walls - if necessary on two levels, with switching areas in several places and planning to treat the layout as a series of modules that can be taken apart to work on. I'd spend the next 3 weeks making up a list of givens and druthers - what you MUST have, and what you would LIKE to include - and then the next couple of months looking at track planning books and layout designs on the interwebbything and taking the best bits from several of them. I've been planning layouts for long enough to know that interests change - and that what you think will be a lifetime layout now , sure as hell won't be in 2 to 5 years time, and you'll be ripping it out and carting boards down to the tip........but, RULE !, it is your layout!
PS - do a search for model Railroad track plans on google images or bing images
PPS -" Heart of Georgia" might be worth a look for an idea
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