05-29-2010, 06:14 PM
Gary,
I almost have to laugh and cry at the same time when I read this. As a railroad cop for over 33 years I have dealt with this from several different positions. Let me start by saying THIS IS AMERICA and you have the legal right to photograph anything you want, especially if you can see it from a public place. That being said you must also understand several things:
1. Most people have no clue what that means. It means that if you stand on the sidewalk and photograph a train, plane, building, police car, etc. you have broken no laws. I could
go into the Fourth Amendment and bore you to death with it. Just remember, if you can see it without trespassing (anywhere) you can photograph it (you can watch your naked
neighbor in their home legally from the public sidewalk. It's up to them to close the curtains). BUT, that does not mean someone who is not familiar with you and your activity might
not get suspicious and call the police. In this case the police must check it out. It is their job and responsibility and they must answer every call one way or another. May I add this,
never give the cop a hard time in the street, he will always win. He has lots of friends out there and they show up without notice. I suspect this young cop was just green and not
familiar with rail fanning activity. He's learning, as is evidenced by the old cop chewing his butt for stopping where he did. That's how we gain street experience. On the other hand
I think the old cop was wrong by allowing you to see and hear him chastising the younger cop. I would have helped him clear the call and explain his error in private later.
2. I am a railfan and have been for ever. Many of my fellow railroad employees also are railfan. However, most of us don't like railfans because too many
of them push the limits. The railroad companies don't mind you taking photos of their trains. They do not want you TRESPASSING to do so. That makes you a liability. Way too
many railfans think they know it all and think that because they know a little more about trains they can take "privileges". Keep in mind, train crews report most every trespassing
violation they see. Naturally, railroad police are spread pretty thin so we transfer the call to the local police department (LPD) for handling. Legally that is a request for service from
a resident of that community (the railroad). LPD will respond and take appropriate action, including arrest. And they are not as understanding as railroad cops. OK, I know what most
railfans think of railroad cops but believe it or not, they are more lenient than state or local cops.....cause we know what a railfan is, remember?
3. In today's social environment and our out of control government seeing terrorist everywhere one must expect to be contacted by law enforcement anywhere, any time. Be aware,
you don't know what has transpired to bring you in contact with this cop. The Department of Homeland Security (DHS) puts out page after page of sensitive intelligence info and
suspicious persons and activity. It just might happen that YOU resemble someone who they are watching. It's his job and responsibility to confirm that you either are or are not
someone they want. Give the cops the courtesy and respect the deserve while doing their jobs. Granted, they are people too and some are jerks. Just remember, they are the
biggest 'street gang' in the US and they will always win out there. If you have a complaint take it to the chief later. There are processes in place to handle it. And don't demand
he be fired because you're offended. Ask that the situation be explained and that maybe he could be a little more friendly next time.
My other advice is to print out and carry with you a copy of the photographers rights as mentioned by Charlie above. <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm">http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm</a><!-- m --> It's a good guide for you and anyone who might question your activities.
Kevin
I almost have to laugh and cry at the same time when I read this. As a railroad cop for over 33 years I have dealt with this from several different positions. Let me start by saying THIS IS AMERICA and you have the legal right to photograph anything you want, especially if you can see it from a public place. That being said you must also understand several things:
1. Most people have no clue what that means. It means that if you stand on the sidewalk and photograph a train, plane, building, police car, etc. you have broken no laws. I could
go into the Fourth Amendment and bore you to death with it. Just remember, if you can see it without trespassing (anywhere) you can photograph it (you can watch your naked
neighbor in their home legally from the public sidewalk. It's up to them to close the curtains). BUT, that does not mean someone who is not familiar with you and your activity might
not get suspicious and call the police. In this case the police must check it out. It is their job and responsibility and they must answer every call one way or another. May I add this,
never give the cop a hard time in the street, he will always win. He has lots of friends out there and they show up without notice. I suspect this young cop was just green and not
familiar with rail fanning activity. He's learning, as is evidenced by the old cop chewing his butt for stopping where he did. That's how we gain street experience. On the other hand
I think the old cop was wrong by allowing you to see and hear him chastising the younger cop. I would have helped him clear the call and explain his error in private later.
2. I am a railfan and have been for ever. Many of my fellow railroad employees also are railfan. However, most of us don't like railfans because too many
of them push the limits. The railroad companies don't mind you taking photos of their trains. They do not want you TRESPASSING to do so. That makes you a liability. Way too
many railfans think they know it all and think that because they know a little more about trains they can take "privileges". Keep in mind, train crews report most every trespassing
violation they see. Naturally, railroad police are spread pretty thin so we transfer the call to the local police department (LPD) for handling. Legally that is a request for service from
a resident of that community (the railroad). LPD will respond and take appropriate action, including arrest. And they are not as understanding as railroad cops. OK, I know what most
railfans think of railroad cops but believe it or not, they are more lenient than state or local cops.....cause we know what a railfan is, remember?
3. In today's social environment and our out of control government seeing terrorist everywhere one must expect to be contacted by law enforcement anywhere, any time. Be aware,
you don't know what has transpired to bring you in contact with this cop. The Department of Homeland Security (DHS) puts out page after page of sensitive intelligence info and
suspicious persons and activity. It just might happen that YOU resemble someone who they are watching. It's his job and responsibility to confirm that you either are or are not
someone they want. Give the cops the courtesy and respect the deserve while doing their jobs. Granted, they are people too and some are jerks. Just remember, they are the
biggest 'street gang' in the US and they will always win out there. If you have a complaint take it to the chief later. There are processes in place to handle it. And don't demand
he be fired because you're offended. Ask that the situation be explained and that maybe he could be a little more friendly next time.
My other advice is to print out and carry with you a copy of the photographers rights as mentioned by Charlie above. <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm">http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm</a><!-- m --> It's a good guide for you and anyone who might question your activities.
Kevin