"Cruise ship Fiasco"
#1
With all the hoop-la about the Carnival "Triumph" "dead-in-the-water", and looking at the size of that ship - - - - -

USS Enterprise CVN-65, which was no small ship, was.....
1,122' long,only 230' longer than "Triumph"
132' beam, 16' wider than "Triumph"
94,780 Tons displacement, 6,720 tons less, then "Triumph"
Drew 39', 12' deeper than "Triumph".

An Aircraft carrier was only 230' longer,16' wider ( waterline width ), rode 12' deeper, and - - -
weighed 6,720 tons !!! Less that a "Cruise Ship" ??

"Triumph" was a floating "Country", five days without working bathrooms, running water, or power !!!
I think my next "cruise" will be in a one-man CANOE !!!! Icon_twisted Icon_twisted Icon_twisted Icon_lol Icon_lol
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#2
Sumpter250 Wrote:"Triumph" was a floating "Country", five days without working bathrooms, running water, or power !!!
I think my next "cruise" will be in a one-man CANOE !!!! Icon_twisted Icon_twisted Icon_twisted Icon_lol Icon_lol
Last time I was in one, The Canoe didn't have working bathrooms (except for "docking in the woods"), running water (unless the creek was "drinkable"), or power (unless you count the oars). Icon_twisted Goldth Goldth Icon_lol

But yeah - even 2 days without all that would not be good!!!
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~~ I wonder what that would look like in 1:20.3???
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#3
Sumpter250 Wrote:...
... without working bathrooms ...

... including not working toilets!!!! I'm sure that you also mean it but I must write it additional.
Cheers, Bernd

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#4
Now I'm not a nautical design engineer, but I wondered from day one why they didn't have enough auxiliary power generators to provide basic necessities such as running toilets, refrigeration and other kitchen things to keep food fresh and serve hot. :o I also wonder why they didn't drop a bunch of gas-powered generators down on deck to give them some additional power. Eek

Let's see, take a cruise around the Mediterranean and wind up fighting pirates or running aground. Take a trip in the Caribbean or the Gulf and wind up dead in the water. This isn't the first time this has happened there.

Would I take a cruise anywhere? Nope I think I'd feel safer on Pete's canoe. At least I'd know what facilities were available before we started and wouldn't have to count on 1,000 cruise ship staff to be sure my needs are met as advertised in the brochure. I'm sure Pete could whip up a mean onion sandwich. Icon_lol
Don (ezdays) Day
Board administrator and
founder of the CANYON STATE RAILROAD
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#5
Add this to last years fiasco off the coast of Italy and I would be considering a name change if I were Carnival. They awarded a new title to that ship captain - Chicken of the Sea. Icon_lol
Mike Kieran
Port Able Lines

" If the world were perfect, it wouldn't be " - Yogi Berra.
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#6
There was a similar episode in the Pacific several years ago. The Carnival Splendor had exactly the same problem and had to be towed back to San Diego in 2010, with passengers in exactly the same straits.

I don't think I would take a Carnival cruise.
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#7
There have always been significant and unanswered questions about the lack of back-up equipment and the inability of a major outfit like Carnival to rise to the occasion and deal with the issues. Portapotties dropped on deck, for example. MRE's, as another example. Blankets and/or sleeping bags. Portable propane heaters. Portable pumps to provide water to flush the toilets. Portable generators to operate the kitchens. This is kid's stuff, and not doing it is nothing less than criminal negligence by Carnival, especially given their abysmal record of similar failures.

A major earthquake on the other side of the world generates a faster response than Carnival can mange in almost a week. I strongly suspect that has entirely to do with the extra cost of responding properly. The first time someone dies as a result of one of these mismanagement fiascos, Carnival will be out of business forever form the resulting lawsuits.

There is no way whatsoever that I would pay good money to a crappy outfit like Carnival so that they can reap a profit from my danger and discomfort.
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#8
This never happened to Captain Stubing on the Love Boat did it ? Misngth

T
To err is human, to blame it on somebody else shows management potential.
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#9
teejay Wrote:This never happened to Captain Stubing on the Love Boat did it ? Misngth

T
And hey, the "Skipper" only did it once with the Minnow, just like the captain of the Concordia did, but he managed to get everyone aboard safely to some remote island:
  • Just sit right back and you'll hear a tale,
    A tale of a fateful trip
    That started from this tropic port
    Aboard this tiny ship.

    The mate was a mighty sailing man,
    The skipper brave and sure.
    Five passengers set sail that day
    For a three hour tour, a three hour tour...
Don (ezdays) Day
Board administrator and
founder of the CANYON STATE RAILROAD
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#10
See, now this is just one of the million horror stories I have heard from my scuba diving customers for the last 25 years. Now you know why I have never personally stepped foot on a cruise ship, except when I used to drag snorkelers off 'em when I was a wee lad diver....

You couldn't pay me to go on a cruise...
Cheers,
Richard

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#11
   
To err is human, to blame it on somebody else shows management potential.
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#12
As far as backup generators and MRE's and carrying extra things "just in case" - I wonder if it has anything to do with the idea that all this extra stuff takes up room... We wouldn't want to take a cabin or 2 that creates revenue and turn it into "non-money making" storage would we????? Eek

Hmmmmm I seem to remember a ship that sank with "too few" lifeboats, because they took up too much room and that "too many lifeboats" would cause unnecessary worry amongst the passengers of "The Unsinkable Ship".......
~~ Mikey KB3VBR (Admin)
~~ NARA Member # 75    
~~ Baldwin Eddystone Unofficial Website

~~ I wonder what that would look like in 1:20.3???
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#13
Um ...um , I know , I know .........there was an ...iceberg , yeah ......and , and , .....what was the question ? Goldth
To err is human, to blame it on somebody else shows management potential.
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#14
teejay Wrote:Um ...um , I know , I know .........there was an ...iceberg , yeah ......and , and , .....what was the question ? Goldth
Icon_lol Icon_lol Icon_lol
~~ Mikey KB3VBR (Admin)
~~ NARA Member # 75    
~~ Baldwin Eddystone Unofficial Website

~~ I wonder what that would look like in 1:20.3???
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#15
ezdays Wrote:Now I'm not a nautical design engineer, but I wondered from day one why they didn't have enough auxiliary power generators to provide basic necessities such as running toilets, refrigeration and other kitchen things to keep food fresh and serve hot. :o I also wonder why they didn't drop a bunch of gas-powered generators down on deck to give them some additional power. Eek

Let's see, take a cruise around the Mediterranean and wind up fighting pirates or running aground. Take a trip in the Caribbean or the Gulf and wind up dead in the water. This isn't the first time this has happened there.

Would I take a cruise anywhere? Nope I think I'd feel safer on Pete's canoe. At least I'd know what facilities were available before we started and wouldn't have to count on 1,000 cruise ship staff to be sure my needs are met as advertised in the brochure. I'm sure Pete could whip up a mean onion sandwich. Icon_lol


Well let me try to answer some of that, I used to work as an electrical engineer on board cruiseships until a few years ago (at Holland America Line), done that for nearly 19 years.

Cruiseship powerplants are set up nowadays as a power station. they have an x number of (diesel) generators that supply the electricity, and with that they do everything else. The propellers are driven by big electric motors, the thrusters, the AC the lighting, refridgiration etc etc etc all is powered (via transformers etc) from these main diesel generators. In addition there is an emergency generator on board, but this is only big enough to power your emergency items, such as your lifeboat stations and nearby floodlights, some basic navigation and communication equipment, emergency lighting, some hospital supplies (yes there are is a small hospital (infirmary) on board), one or two cooling water pumps, usually also 1 or 2 sewage pumps a reefer compressor and a few elevators. That generator has enough fuel supply to last several days, and as long as it can power it's fuel supply pump they can pump fuel from their tanks below and keep it running for a week or more.

Obviously all the other limited gear being supplied is designed such that everything can cope with an interruption of a few hours, or long enough to go through an abandon ship procedure et. The few left over sewage pumps would not have been big enough to cope with the entire ship's sewage system, and I'd imagine that after several hours to a day, these pumps simply couldn't keep up the 'vacuum' on their own (usually vacuum toilet systems) and the pipes start blocking up.

While I cannot speculate on the layout of this particular ship, I think that the fire they had has caused damage to their main distribution board, or cables in the area, so that the rest of the ship could no longer be supplied with electricity. It probably also only had 1 such switchboard.
Newer designs have a 'split' distribution system, divided over separate rooms, which is normally connected together, but in the event of a problem, can be isolated and half the generators feed that system. This is usually sufficient to leave all systems running normally, but will only supply half power to the propellers etc.
The Triumph may not have had that layout, as it is something that has only started to be incorporated in cruise ship designs of the past 6 years or so.
Triumph is based on a series of ships of which the first one is older than that, and probably based on that basic design.

Hope that answers some of your questions. :-)

Koos
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