Before I say anything else, I think an apology is in order: for some unknown reason - age probably - I've been referring to this little loco in these amassed pages of drivel (composed by 'moi') as an Athearn Model. As is quite obvious from the photos, it isn't; it's Atlas. May I offer, therefore, my sincerest apologies for having misled you All over the last couple of weeks or so, and especially to the Athearn Model Railroad company whose product I have continuously and erroneously slighted. I'm sincerely sorry and really need to get my facts right!
Humbly yours,
Jonte
PS.....thanks Koos for drawing this to my attention. Jonte.
no worries Jonte :-) It was not meant to embarrass you, I just realised that my ramblings on how to improve the running of your Athearn, would not work 100% for an Atlas. There are a few constructional differences. Anyway, take a piccie of it's guts, as I am curious if it's a chinese build Atlas, or an Austrian build (by Roco) or other. If it's a Roco build, then you should be able to get a good replacement motor , as Roco is still in business, and you can get / order parts from any dealer that does european outline and sells Roco. Does it have plastic drive shafts from motor to gear tower, or a sort of curled spring?
Koos
Koos, it may also be a Kato built running gear. Atlas used Kato to make their locomotives for quite a few years before they went back to Roco, and then ultimately to China for their manufacturing source.
well there you go, I didn't know that, thanks Russ. :-) In any case, lets see if Jonte can supply us with a picture, depending on what it is, someone here will know how to best maintain it, and get the loco running properly again. :-)
Koos
torikoos Wrote:well there you go, I didn't know that, thanks Russ. :-) In any case, lets see if Jonte can supply us with a picture, depending on what it is, someone here will know how to best maintain it, and get the loco running properly again. :-)
Koos
Hi Koos and apologies for the delay.
Took a series of shots of locos innards, however, I'm afraid these are the best of the bunch (all the close up shots were out of focus
).
I guess photography is just something else I need to practise
Please let me know if you require any further shots and I'll do my best to oblige. Thanks again for your kind offer of help.
Jonte
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In addendum, I've perused the exploded diagram that accompanied the documentation and it would appear that the gearing is connected to the fly wheel on each side by a male and female universal (coupling?).
Hope this might be of help.
Jonte
Hi Jonte, I've got to admit that I'm not certain what it is, how old is the loco, do you happen to know?
Roco , for many years produced a series of electric motors that were fully enclosed (a bit like the modern day Mashima motors), they had no carbon brushes you could exchange, they were supposed to last a very long time (thousands of hours) , and then you'd swap the entire motor. They did produce a few open frame motors, like the one in your loco. They all had skew wound armatures, like your motor (this had better magnetic performance, and therefore the motor was stronger, and smoother) has too. However, the flywheels put me off. Roco did initially not install flywheels in many smaller locos, they had little effect at that size, later , more due to marketing pressure than a technical one, they did... Can you see the worm wheel, or any of the other gears? The gears used to be red and white in many roco engines.
It all actually looks more modern than those Roco engines would be if I'm honest, and this could well be an Atlas build, be it chinese or other. Perhaps someone else knows?
In any case, if it is confirmed what it is (does it say anywhere where it was build, on the box, or somewhere on a plastic part?) Atlas still provides spare parts for many of their locos (<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.asp?Cc=ALLPARTS">https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.asp?Cc=ALLPARTS</a><!-- m --> ) , should you need any, but I'd start with cleaning everything out as best you can. A bit of air to blow away any carbon dust from the motor if there is any, it looks pretty clean on this picture though...
Koos
Hi Jonte, I had a quick second look, this actually does look like it was an Austrian build Atlas (by Roco)
See this page, your motor and your brushes are right at the top. <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.asp?Cc=PH78A&iTpStatus=0&Tp=&Bc=">https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.a ... =0&Tp=&Bc=</a><!-- m -->
You should be able to order from them direct, I did for some plastic detail parts, and got shipped (received) within 2 weeks.
Koos
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.asp?Cc=PH78A&iTpStatus=0&Tp=&Bc=">https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.a ... =0&Tp=&Bc=</a><!-- m -->
torikoos Wrote:Hi Jonte, I had a quick second look, this actually does look like it was an Austrian build Atlas (by Roco)
See this page, your motor and your brushes are right at the top. <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.asp?Cc=PH78A&iTpStatus=0&Tp=&Bc=">https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.a ... =0&Tp=&Bc=</a><!-- m -->
You should be able to order from them direct, I did for some plastic detail parts, and got shipped (received) within 2 weeks.
Koos
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.asp?Cc=PH78A&iTpStatus=0&Tp=&Bc=">https://secure.atlasrr.com/mod1/items.a ... =0&Tp=&Bc=</a><!-- m -->
Wow Koos. You certainly know your stuff; I'm compressed
Very kind of you to do all this leg work on my behalf, and so promptly too. I'm extremely grateful.
Now here's a plan: I'm going to purchase said controller anyway, as it sounds a panacea to me. In the meantime, I'm going to perform a series of backwards and forwards motions on a spare piece of track and at a variety of speeds to see if I can run it in. I mention this as the previous owner stated that it had never been used; perhaps I should have mentioned this before. In the event that neither works, I shall opt for a new motor and brushes as the loco fulfills my needs in terms of a small layout being LAJ based, so it'll be worth the outlay.
I hope and trust this meets with your approval, Koos. As a newby, your opinions and advice are invaluable.
Best wishes,
Jonte
(Hope I'll have something else to show you tomorrow) Jonte.
I have the older Roco Atlas and the newer China Atlas switchers. The China one never ran well or pulled more than several cars without spinning its wheels. I found that it was only getting power to the front truck. While checking the wiring connection found that the screws that hold the board with the led on it were loose. After retightening them it now runs and pulls as well as the older Roco engine. Maybe this is the case with yours. By the way if you look on the bottom of the chassis it will say either made in China or made in Austria(Roco)
Bruce
Hi Jonte,
Well if it's never been used,things are easier, and then don't worry about new motors and brushes (although buying a few brushes for future spares is not a bad idea). You just need to run it in most likely. It can be that the oils/grease from factory has dried out over the years, so try and add a few drops of oil (no bigger than a grain of rice each) to the gears and then try again. Obviously not just any oil. Get some designed for models etc. At a push, sowing machine oil will do, but I would first check with your local hobby shop. A US brand is called Labelle, but in the UK, I think Modelmaster supplies it.
For running in, you may need it to run a little longer, and I would suggest to see if you can apply the power to the motor with a few wires directly, and have the loco lifted from the track (upside down or so) so you can run it for a longer period in one direction, while adding a drop of oil when it's running.
As you did say you were going to remain with DC , then a controller as you mentioned is a good investment, they usually help in the slow speed regions, at the expense of a little bit more noise from the motor. You can hear 'squeaking' or 'ticking' pulses going through it, but they are harmless. (You also hear this with some DCC decoders, they have a similar motor control internally).
As for me knowing my stuff, I only know mainly what I remember from when I was younger and heavily involved with Roco HO to european outline. The hobby then took a bit of a break, and I picked it up again a few years ago.
Good luck, it sounds like this engine can be rescued easily.
Koos
bdw9535 Wrote:I have the older Roco Atlas and the newer China Atlas switchers. The China one never ran well or pulled more than several cars without spinning its wheels. I found that it was only getting power to the front truck. While checking the wiring connection found that the screws that hold the board with the led on it were loose. After retightening them it now runs and pulls as well as the older Roco engine. Maybe this is the case with yours. By the way if you look on the bottom of the chassis it will say either made in China or made in Austria(Roco)
Bruce
Hi Bruce and many thanks for the advice.
I'll have a look and post it up.
Jonte
torikoos Wrote:Hi Jonte,
Well if it's never been used,things are easier, and then don't worry about new motors and brushes (although buying a few brushes for future spares is not a bad idea). You just need to run it in most likely. It can be that the oils/grease from factory has dried out over the years, so try and add a few drops of oil (no bigger than a grain of rice each) to the gears and then try again. Obviously not just any oil. Get some designed for models etc. At a push, sowing machine oil will do, but I would first check with your local hobby shop. A US brand is called Labelle, but in the UK, I think Modelmaster supplies it.
For running in, you may need it to run a little longer, and I would suggest to see if you can apply the power to the motor with a few wires directly, and have the loco lifted from the track (upside down or so) so you can run it for a longer period in one direction, while adding a drop of oil when it's running.
As you did say you were going to remain with DC , then a controller as you mentioned is a good investment, they usually help in the slow speed regions, at the expense of a little bit more noise from the motor. You can hear 'squeaking' or 'ticking' pulses going through it, but they are harmless. (You also hear this with some DCC decoders, they have a similar motor control internally).
As for me knowing my stuff, I only know mainly what I remember from when I was younger and heavily involved with Roco HO to european outline. The hobby then took a bit of a break, and I picked it up again a few years ago.
Good luck, it sounds like this engine can be rescued easily.
Koos
Yes it certainly does, Koos, thank you.
I'll pop down to the local model shop and see if they've anything suitable - mainly RC models but some model rail stock. I'll also try the 'free running' as you suggest.
As an aside, hope to have a few more pictures up soon in relation to additional lighting and backscene.
Best wishes,
Jonte
Great, looking forward to it Jonte!
By the way, if you do get another loco, and it happens to be an older Athearn, this page is very helpful in how to 'tune' these and get the most out of them.
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.mcor-nmra.org/Publications/Articles/Athearn_TuneUp.html">http://www.mcor-nmra.org/Publications/A ... uneUp.html</a><!-- m -->
The only thing I do not agree with there is using a fine file on the motor commutator. Better is a a piece of very fine sand paper, grade 800 or higher (get it from car repair & paint shops etc), glued to a small stick or so. You need a polishing action, not a 'scraping' or 'scratching' one. That only results in a courser surface and will in turn wear the motor brushes much faster.
Koos
torikoos Wrote:Great, looking forward to it Jonte!
By the way, if you do get another loco, and it happens to be an older Athearn, this page is very helpful in how to 'tune' these and get the most out of them.
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.mcor-nmra.org/Publications/Articles/Athearn_TuneUp.html">http://www.mcor-nmra.org/Publications/A ... uneUp.html</a><!-- m -->
The only thing I do not agree with there is using a fine file on the motor commutator. Better is a a piece of very fine sand paper, grade 800 or higher (get it from car repair & paint shops etc), glued to a small stick or so. You need a polishing action, not a 'scraping' or 'scratching' one. That only results in a courser surface and will in turn wear the motor brushes much faster.
Koos
I don't use any abrasive on Athearn or other open frame motors. I disconnect the drive shafts from the motor to allow it to pick up power from the wheels, but not move. I then use a new #2 pencil eraser on the spinning commutator to clean it off. Polishes it up beautifully. I use a small micro screw driver blade to clean out the slots between the commutator bars. After that I reassemble the locomotive and if I haven't done it already, used Jim Furhman's 5 wire system for wiring up an Athearn locomotive to make as positive electrical connections as possible.
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://trainweb.org/jfuhrtrain/tuneup.htm">http://trainweb.org/jfuhrtrain/tuneup.htm</a><!-- m -->
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://trainweb.org/jfuhrtrain/fivewire.htm">http://trainweb.org/jfuhrtrain/fivewire.htm</a><!-- m -->