Green_Elite_Cab Wrote:Industrial parks are not really prominently pictured or mentioned in most of my books (or at the very least, they are not pointed out).
How true! This is one aspect of the railroad industry that seems to have been greatly overlooked for many years. One that in my opinion is the most interesting aspect of railroading. After all, rail shipments must originate and terminate at their customers.
Couldn't tell you how many times I've seen a photo or video of a crew working such and such an industry and thought to myself, "what are they shipping/receiving" - "what does this facility look like?", etc.
Perhaps with all the interest these days in industrial switching, we'll start to see more information about such operations. Even though my layout is currently in the planning/testing stage but can be operated, I've gotten more enjoyment from modeling and operating an industrial spur than any other layout theme I've gotten in to over the years.
It's great to see modelers like Jack Hill, who actual work in the industry, take the time to photograph and explain the way railroad service works at specific industries/locations. Hope to see more of this in the future. I sure wish I'd taken a camera with me years ago and photographed what took place at the distilleries and other industries around here!
So what type of PECO switches should I get, Their code 83 track is about $10 more per piece than their code 100, I am not sure but I think that the only American track they make is code 83 and the code 100 is based on European track but I may be wrong.
I'd go with the Code 83 and the Insul-frog turnouts. You won't be having all the wiring problems that you'll have with the Electro-frog turnouts and not have to depend so much on how well the points make contact with the stock rails for reliable operation. If you're not operating 4 wheel locomotives, you won't have any problem with loco's stalling going through the turnouts. I have a couple of short wheel base GE 45 ton locomotives that I picked up and they'll walk right through the turnouts without ever stalling.
I use the Insul-frog turnouts and all I need to do is place them where I want and am able to operate the layout with only one set of power feeders to the track. I've changed the track plan around several times over the past couple of months and it only takes me about an hour to completely rearrange the track and turnouts and I'm in business. I do not solder all the joints on my layout(s), other then places where I have a section of track longer than a 36in section of flex or where I want smooth wide radius curves. I made that mistake once years ago and won't do that again. Bad news if you decide to change your track and want to be able to salvage your turnouts.
Once I actually start final construction, I'll put power feeders to every section of track and turnout so I don't have to rely on just the rail joints to feed power.
Incidentally, the Code 100 Peco turnouts may be based on European style, but they blend right in with Atlas flex track and once the rail is painted and the track ballasted, few people can tell the difference. Depends on how detailed you want the track to look. I built one layout some years ago using Code 70 track and turnouts and I always had to point out to people that the rail was much smaller then the code 100, in spite of the obvious size difference.
Justinmiller171 Wrote:So I think the first project I should work on is painting the backdrop, then I should glue down the foam sheets, then I can lay track. The foam and backdrop can get finished fairly soon, however it will take awhile to get all of the track down. I am thinking I could build the layout in stages, starting with the top part, that way I can get some trains running fairly quickly.
I am really excited about this layout, I hope I can build this layout until it is at least "Good Enough"
Here is the newest track-plan, It is not based on any prototypical location, and once again it is mainly just industry changes:
Shouldn't be any problem! I think the most annoying thing is laying the road bed, but if you have the right tools, its not that tricky. Laying track should be VERY easy on your layout. If you use flex track, you're going to more or less be setting down nearly whole sections, perhaps cutting a few overhanging rails here or there so that its all straight. If you have a dremel, this can be done in literally 5 seconds or less per rail. Set one end of the flex track in, bend it to fit, temporarily tack it down, cut the excess, glue/nail down.
Done!
Justinmiller171 Wrote:So what type of PECO switches should I get, Their code 83 track is about $10 more per piece than their code 100, I am not sure but I think that the only American track they make is code 83 and the code 100 is based on European track but I may be wrong.
Peco Medium Type turnouts. Peco track is all HO scale. OO only counts towards English rolling stock and structures. If you read on Peco's site, they explain that most of the world operates on HO (1:87), and so all their track are gauged and scaled to HO. OO scale (1:76) is a British thing, and all OO equipment is gauged for HO scale track.
Peco turnouts are incredibly reliable. They don't require switch machines like Atlas switches do, and work straight out of the box. The switch points are sprung (instead of flapping in the breeze like an Atlas Custom Line), and so they hold in place whichever way you throw them. My club has Peco switches older than I am that they are only now having to replace, and many are still on the older parts of the layout. You should be able to reuse them again and again if you are careful with them.
FCIN Wrote:Green_Elite_Cab Wrote:Industrial parks are not really prominently pictured or mentioned in most of my books (or at the very least, they are not pointed out).
How true! This is one aspect of the railroad industry that seems to have been greatly overlooked for many years. One that in my opinion is the most interesting aspect of railroading. After all, rail shipments must originate and terminate at their customers.
Couldn't tell you how many times I've seen a photo or video of a crew working such and such an industry and thought to myself, "what are they shipping/receiving" - "what does this facility look like?", etc.
Perhaps with all the interest these days in industrial switching, we'll start to see more information about such operations. Even though my layout is currently in the planning/testing stage but can be operated, I've gotten more enjoyment from modeling and operating an industrial spur than any other layout theme I've gotten in to over the years.
It's great to see modelers like Jack Hill, who actual work in the industry, take the time to photograph and explain the way railroad service works at specific industries/locations. Hope to see more of this in the future. I sure wish I'd taken a camera with me years ago and photographed what took place at the distilleries and other industries around here!
Personally, I blame the "Good old Days" crowd. These are the people who stopped watching trains as Amtrak, state agencies and the Mega-Mergers began to take hold from the old railroads.
They lament the disappearance of the PRR, or the destruction of named passenger trains or whatever train from their child hood that got cancelled or abandoned, and just didn't care for the then "New" stuff. This is reflected in Hobby magazines, which constantly feature steam and transition era layouts.
Books on the 1970s are often full of errors and usually focus on how "things have changed" from the pre-merger years, not really on what is happening right that moment.
The other extreme is all the Modern day modeling, but that is less of a problem, with digital cameras (no picture is a waste of film), and bing maps and general information gathering mass. Anything from before the digital age does not seem to be well documented. It makes it a challenge, for sure.
FCIN Wrote:I have a couple of short wheel base GE 45 ton locomotives that I picked up and they'll walk right through the turnouts without ever stalling.
My Trackmobile can handle it, so i'm thinking the Pecos are Go.
Quote:Once I actually start final construction, I'll put power feeders to every section of track and turnout so I don't have to rely on just the rail joints to feed power.
Definitely my plan to put feeders between every other section! no more losses from rail joiners.
Just calculated the cost of the turnouts, $159.54 just for turnouts not including shipping. I know Peco is worth it, but is there a cheaper way? Peco code 100 is alot cheaper, How are they compared to code 83?
Also I am looking for a name for the new layout, It is going to be a freelance industrial park without any specific location.
Justinmiller171 Wrote:Just calculated the cost of the turnouts, $159.54 just for turnouts not including shipping. I know Peco is worth it, but is there a cheaper way? Peco code 100 is alot cheaper, How are they compared to code 83?
Also I am looking for a name for the new layout, It is going to be a freelance industrial park without any specific location.
The only difference between code 100 and code 87 is the height of the rail. its REALLY not worth it unless you're a stickler. just go code 100.
Hmm.. Peco code 100 seems to have European spaced ties and it looks too "Toy-like" for a switching layout. I know I should get Pecos, but Micro-Engineering track look pretty good too. I just don't know how I feel about spending more than $150 on just turnouts.
How about Atlas code 83? It is not top notch but it is affordable, wide used and looks ok with proper ballast and weathering.
Justinmiller171 Wrote:Just calculated the cost of the turnouts, $159.54 just for turnouts not including shipping. I know Peco is worth it, but is there a cheaper way? Peco code 100 is alot cheaper, How are they compared to code 83?
Also I am looking for a name for the new layout, It is going to be a freelance industrial park without any specific location.
I counted 6 turnouts. What size/number are you using? I have a "stockpile" of turnouts for my modules. I use or will use the Walthers-Shinohara code 83 in #4 to #8. They cost me anywhere from $18 to $22, so $160 seems a little high. Who is your source?
I will combine them with Atlas code 83 flex track.
Andrew
6 Micro Engineering code 70 turnouts shipped from Model Railway Post Office (my not so local train shop) is less than $110.00.
Atlas code 83 is slightly less.
Mark
Justinmiller171 Wrote:Hmm.. Peco code 100 seems to have European spaced ties and it looks too "Toy-like" for a switching layout. I know I should get Pecos, but Micro-Engineering track look pretty good too. I just don't know how I feel about spending more than $150 on just turnouts.
The tie spacing on Peco switches are only slightly shorter. Its not really that noticeable, even if you lay a piece of atlas track over it. Also, the small radius turnout DO look toy-like, but you wouldn't be using them.
That said, I just did the math on using Atlas code 83 #6 switches and Caboose hobbies ground throws (the sprung type). its gonna cost you about $104 through MB Klein. This would be a good way to do things, but it does add a little work.
The short Pecos might be a good choice though - you have limited space, and want reliable operation on switches that will be thrown frequently. They have a built in spring (no need for ground throws), and can be thrown with the flick of a finger.
Many members of our modualr club use the Pecos for their reliability. Appearance comes second to operation.
Andrew
MasonJar Wrote:The short Pecos might be a good choice though - you have limited space, and want reliable operation on switches that will be thrown frequently. They have a built in spring (no need for ground throws), and can be thrown with the flick of a finger.
Many members of our modualr club use the Pecos for their reliability. Appearance comes second to operation.
Andrew
True, but Justin isn't wrong about the costs. I suspect he went to MB Klein, because when I put in the cost of the six turnouts, it did come out to exactly the same price he posted, and MB Klein gives some of the better deals available on the internet.
While I personally would prefer Pecos (again, you get what you pay for), Atlas switches are still reliable and functional pieces of track. Given that he has a limited budget, and the flex track alone will likely cost the $60 he saves, He's probably better off with the Custom-lines and ground throws.
They may not be as high quality, but they still have a high threshold of reliablity that should last for a while.
Atlas track is cheap, in both the good and bad way, I want to build this layout right this time
Micro-Engineering says its turnouts have "Snap Action Sprung Switch Rails". Is this the same feature that Pecos have?
BTW I still need a name!
