Mike Kieran Wrote:Could I make a suggestion? If you make the turnout into Consolidated Container a right hand turnout instead of a left hand turnout, Eagle Foods would be able to fit 4 cars instead of 3 cars. Another result of the turnout change is that the line would look like part of the mainline with Consolidated Container branching off instead of the mainline branching off of Consolidated Container.

I tried that, but even with Stein's plan it still requires a train to go through an S-curve when switching Consolidated Container, Even with a straight section in-between it still doesn't look right to me.

Mike Kieran Wrote:I would also put the transload to the front of the storage track instead of at the rear. This way you can switch the customer without disturbing the cars on the storage track unless you use the storage track for another customer. How about a building supply? Flats, box cars, hoppers, covered hoppers, gondolas, flat cars, center beam cars, etc.

Since the transload will be switched alot less often than the storage, I opted to leave it at the end, But I agree with you about changing Premier to a Building Supply

Justinmiller171 Wrote:

Mike Kieran Wrote:Could I make a suggestion? If you make the turnout into Consolidated Container a right hand turnout instead of a left hand turnout, Eagle Foods would be able to fit 4 cars instead of 3 cars. Another result of the turnout change is that the line would look like part of the mainline with Consolidated Container branching off instead of the mainline branching off of Consolidated Container.

I tried that, but even with Stein's plan it still requires a train to go through an S-curve when switching Consolidated Container, Even with a straight section in-between it still doesn't look right to me.

1) If you go curve - car length straight - curve in the opposite direction, it is not an S-curve.
2) But if it looks bad to you, it looks bad to you.

Smile,
Stein

1) If you go curve - car length straight - curve in the opposite direction, it is not an S-curve.
Smile,
Stein
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I have been mystified for years why a there is even a concern about a "S" curve in a slow speed switching area. :?: Its not like its a high speed mainline.

I've been using them for years with no problems.

Brakie Wrote:1) If you go curve - car length straight - curve in the opposite direction, it is not an S-curve.
Smile,
Stein
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I have been mystified for years why a there is even a concern about a "S" curve in a slow speed switching area. :?: Its not like its a high speed mainline.

I've been using them for years with no problems.

Certainly. Going through a crossover from one track to the next is also in principle an S-curve. It might not be the greatest idea to shove a long string of passenger train (or 89' freight cars) through a crossover made up of two #4 turnouts, but there is no problem backing up 40-foot cars through a crossover made by Peco Medium turnouts.

I was just pointing out that if Justin was worried about S-curves, he could always just stick a piece of straight track between the two opposing curves.

Smile,
Stein

Justin,

Do you mean that it didn't look right in the track plan or it didn't look right when you laid it out? If you didn't lay them out, photocopy the track and lay them out on the benchwork to double check the track visually.

I think that Stein is onto something. Remember, the line is a former mainline and the spur to the container company would diverge from the mainline. If the curve doesn't look kosher, consider putting some small buildings between the layout edge and the track. At slow switching speeds, you won't have any problems.

FCIN Wrote:

Mike Kieran Wrote:Glad to see that you're up and about Ed . Does the pacemaker change TV channels unexpectedly?

That's a good one! So far that hasn't happened, but whenever I use the microwave oven, I have to hit the start button and then take cover! Microwaves and metal detectors are two items I'm supposed to avoid.

So far, I have very little energy and tire out very quickly. Started working on a building mockup a few hours ago and just had to quit and go sit down for a while. Haven't even managed to complete one operating session on the layout since I got home last week. After about 30 minutes, I'm just too tired to continue with it.

Really want to get working on the layout "for real", but I'm going to have to be in a lot better shape then I am right now.

Hey Ed, a good sense of humor always helps during the recovery. You know, if you switch to a 12: 1 fast clock ratio, an 8 hour shift is 40 minutes since each hour equals 5 minutes. that's the fast clock ratio that I'm using for my Port Able Railway.

Err.... Nevermind, I did some alterations and the curved plan looks good now, Here it is:

Justinmiller171 Wrote:Err.... Nevermind, I did some alterations and the curved plan looks good now, Here it is:

That looks good Justin. Could you work in a left hand turnout leading in to Consolidated at the end of the curve? About where the first gray colored car is in your plan (middle of the train)? Seems like it would give you a little better flow of the track into the industry and even increase the length of the track by about a car length.

For info, if you're going with the Peco turnouts, the medium turnouts will fit a 36in radius curve and the long turnouts a 60in radius curve.

Just something to consider. Otherwise it looks good at this point with the interchange track and Consolidated tracks coming off the former main line.

Justin,

Why did you give up the Food Company? Food processors are great sources of traffic. I was suggesting that instead of a storage track, you could put in a building supply (an edge of the layout industry). It just seems that the entire right side of the layout is one big drill track.

If you put a right hand turnout on the other side of Colfax Avenue, it could lead into the food processor that was in the corner. You can also put in a left hand turnout behind the right hand turnout on the other side of Colfax Avenue for a building supply if you want to keep the storage track. I would also add a ready mix plant to the building supply or put the Goldenflame coal silos in for a sand and gravel addition to the business. Good for 5 carloads a week. The storage track can also be for a salvage dealer with variable carloads a week.

Crossing Colfax Avenue creates an operating wrinkle by having to stop the train, flag the crossing, and try not to block the road for too long. It's a great way to stretch tour operating session. I planned this on my layout before Lance Mindheim mentioned it in his book, but it's good to see I'm not the only one with this view.

Mike Kieran Wrote:Justin,

Why did you give up the Food Company? Food processors are great sources of traffic. I was suggesting that instead of a storage track, you could put in a building supply (an edge of the layout industry). It just seems that the entire right side of the layout is one big drill track.

This may sound strange, but I don't want too much operation on this layout, Consolidated Container will provide plenty of operation by itself, Premier chemical and the Building supply are just for added interest

A storage track is required for this layout, there is no drill track on this layout since there are no empty tracks, I can't use the right side of the layout as a drill track since there is no runaround. And I don't want a runaround

Justinmiller171 Wrote:This may sound strange, but I don't want too much operation on this layout, Consolidated Container will provide plenty of operation by itself, Premier chemical and the Building supply are just for added interest

A storage track is required for this layout, there is no drill track on this layout since there are no empty tracks, I can't use the right side of the layout as a drill track since there is no runaround. And I don't want a runaround

Certainly doesn't sound strange to me Justin. Consolidated Container would be a very rail intensive operation and no doubt the reason for the existence of the spur. A facility like that one might require switching twice a day to keep up their production. You can find numerous examples of industrial spurs around the country that primarily serve one large industry and may or may not have one or two other small industries on them.

Lately, I've been wondering to myself if I'm trying to include too much on my own ISL. All of the current industries are pretty much required to support my freight car fleet, but I may take a second look at just how many separate industries and tracks I should include. How much is too much?

By the way, a drill track does not require the use of a run-around. It's simply a track (usually found in a yard) where you can make moves to switch cars without fouling the main track. In your case, the main line could be called a drill track when you are switching Consolidated, but I wouldn't call it that. It's simply the main or lead.

FCIN Wrote:

Justinmiller171 Wrote:By the way, a drill track does not require the use of a run-around. It's simply a track (usually found in a yard) where you can make moves to switch cars without fouling the main track. In your case, the main line could be called a drill track when you are switching Consolidated, but I wouldn't call it that. It's simply the main or lead.

I know, Mike was saying that the right hand of the layout(The switching lead for the industries) could be used as a drill track, but there would be no way to keep cars there without trapping the loco.

The interchange track will be used as a drill track during the ops sessions, but there will be times where cars will need to be stored on the layout.

I should be getting the turnouts in a couple of weeks. In the meantime I will be cleaning off my old Atlas code 100
I have been cleaning off one piece all day, I used a lens cleaner wipe and it worked good at first, but after I ran the engine on it for awhile it has only gotten worse and worse .
Getting track running reliably is definitely my least favorite part of this "Hobby"

Ed, just for the heck of it I redrew Consolidated Container with 2 tracks:


It does look pretty good, but it will cost me another turnout, although I might just build this part now, and then build the right leg later.

Justinmiller171 Wrote:Ed, just for the heck of it I redrew Consolidated Container with 2 tracks:


It does look pretty good, but it will cost me another turnout, although I might just build this part now, and then build the part right leg later.

That looks darn good Justin. Should give you a bit more operation for Consolidated as you'll often have empties pull from the "Upper Dock" and re-spot at the "Lower Dock". I'd go with this arrangement if you can swing the extra turnout. Lining cars up to spot on a single track can be quite interesting, but were I modeling this facility, then I'd try and include both tracks to more closely model the actual facility.

Justin,

It look's like a mirror image of Lance Mindheim's Palmetto Spur and looks really good to me too.

Mark